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how long for Stage 1 gentoo install?

post #1 of 31
10/26/05 at 4:32pm
Thread Starter 
my predicament is this. I'm trying to put linux onto my sager 3880. my only real option at home is wireless, and the signal is pretty iffy (im usually constantly switching between my network and my neighbor's, shhh, don't tell!). i can't use ethernet at home because the cable modem is in my roomates room and i don't want to be in there forever if it takes a long time. but i can use the ethernet on campus, which is pretty fast. my question is this. if i get everything partitioned right and do as much offline as i can, how long do i have to be plugged in to get everything it needs? do i have to be there typing commands and whatnot or is it a scripted download (can i just leave it in my roomate's room for a day and come back to get it when it's done)? can i download everything it needs for the install and burn it onto the CD along with the mini OS that I boot from? or do i really need to steal my roomates room for a day?
I really want to do a stage 1 install. i've messed around with Kubunto for a while, and know my way pretty decently around the unix filestructure, although i still don't know how to do anything with bash. I want to do a stage 1 install so i can just get it over with, and learn my way around the system really well. so basically stage 2 or 3 tarballs are out.
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post #2 of 31
10/26/05 at 5:25pm
Well... you CAN get a package CD, but I highly reccomend against it. I would strongly suggest getting a long ethernet cable to run down the hall(Anything under 100 yards will work fine) and do it at your house. For a full stage 1 install on my Opteron based machine it took several days to get everything up and running I needed to, admitedly I wasnt going non stop but this is starting several compiles and going to bed for the night, or to school, or to work while they worked and then continuing when I got home.

If you want to try it, look for a package CD iso and make sure you follow the instructions for using the package CD(Should be able to download it from the same site you download the install CD).

Seablade
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post #3 of 31
10/26/05 at 8:41pm
Thread Starter 
does this package cd contain all the packages necessary for a stage 1 install? also, i bring my notebook to class, can i do some compilation at home, stop, boot up windows for class, and come back and finish later?
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post #4 of 31
10/26/05 at 10:51pm
Well in as far as the package CD I believe so but check on the Gentoo site, it should say if I remember right. Double check on my memory to be sure.

In as far as the start/stop/resume... yes and no. Any program you stop the compilation of in the middle of it you will have to start over from the begining I believe, or maybe from the begining of the file, but I think from the begining of the program. However you can compile some programs, be halfway through the dependancy of a third, stop it, and restart wherever in that dependancies you left off from the top of that file/program, if that makes any sense. So yes you can but there are some limitations, and there are certain points you DONT want to stop during(Mainly the early part of the installation, once you can reboot into your system its not as big a deal, though you may want to do things like set up your ethernet connection before you do so as well just for ease of use).

Seablade
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post #5 of 31
10/27/05 at 11:40am
Assuming a 2.4GHz+ machine and that you know what you're doing, 30 minutes for initial set-up, about 2 hours for bootstrapping (unattended) and about 2 hours for system base. So I'd say let it bootstrap, then come back and launch the system base emerge along with all the other big things like X (<1 hour), Firefox (<1 hour), Thunderbird (<1 hour), KDE/GNOME (3+ hours) if you're into those, etc. Then come back in the morning to start fiddling

In other words, the compiles don't take THAT long. Most of the time you'll spend tweaking the box to your preference. This "time investment" is there for any distro or OS.
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post #6 of 31
10/27/05 at 3:09pm
I am not sure how much I agree with your times there Markin, I seem to remember mine being a bit longer, not including the tweak and customize time spent in text editors.

Seablade
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post #7 of 31
10/27/05 at 3:44pm
I guess what I don't understand is exactly why you want to do a stage 1 as opposed to a stage 2. If there's already a stage 2 setup for your architecture (which I would bet there is considering sager is a mainstream company), then I don't think you really gain anything by doing a stage 1. It certainly won't improve performance, as you should just get somethin constant that someone else has already done. Trust me, you'll learn plenty by doing a stage 2 install an save yourself some unecessary steps. You still get to to learn chroot, and then do kernel configuration, and all that good stuff with a stage 2. It is the stage 2 stuff which is critical for individual system optimization.

As for the ethernet, I would just recommend that you get a long ethernet cord and run from the modem at your place.

Good luck!
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post #8 of 31
10/27/05 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by seablade
I am not sure how much I agree with your times there Markin, I seem to remember mine being a bit longer, not including the tweak and customize time spent in text editors.

Seablade
Its pretty close as far as I can remember. The bootstrapping is definitely around 2 hours on a 2.4GHz laptop. In fact, the compile time does not scale linearly; bootstrapping only takes about 3 hours on a P3 666! The reason for the small difference is probably the drive speed - my laptop drive is only 5400RPM.

The system base does not take much longer than the bootstrapping (on my laptop; I am not sure how long the P3 took as it I left it going overnight). It is a given that the entire system will need libraries and other dependancies before X, etc can be built, but it shouldn't be bad.

For reference, I know for a fact that Firefox builds in 35 minutes with my current specs (P4 3.2C, 1GB DDR400, 5400RPM drive).
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post #9 of 31
10/27/05 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by udrongo
I guess what I don't understand is exactly why you want to do a stage 1 as opposed to a stage 2. If there's already a stage 2 setup for your architecture (which I would bet there is considering sager is a mainstream company), then I don't think you really gain anything by doing a stage 1. It certainly won't improve performance, as you should just get somethin constant that someone else has already done. Trust me, you'll learn plenty by doing a stage 2 install an save yourself some unecessary steps. You still get to to learn chroot, and then do kernel configuration, and all that good stuff with a stage 2. It is the stage 2 stuff which is critical for individual system optimization.

As for the ethernet, I would just recommend that you get a long ethernet cord and run from the modem at your place.

Good luck!
Well you do get a small boost in performance, but not much of one, it all depends on how customized you want it to be for your architecture, for instance there is a difference between compiled code on an AMD64 and a Opteron, but they use the same stage installs I believe because they are similar(NOTE: I could be wrong on that, but this is my best guess from what I have seen)

Now if the point is to learn linux then a stage 1 is definitly a great idea. If the point is to install Gentoo in as short a time as possible though to make sure it doesnt interfere with classes, a stage 3 is a better idea. It all depends on what you want to get out of it.

Seablade
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post #10 of 31
10/31/05 at 3:57am
Thread Starter 
thanks guys! i think im gonna do a stage 1, and just run an ethernet cord from my roomate's room to mine. i def wanna do the stage 1 and figure it out, as soon as i get a slow classwork period (probably not for several years!). a few more questions, how much has to be done to get it to run off of the hard drive (boot into gentoo) instead of off the live CD? also, about when should i install the boot manager (grub or what have you). are these things covered in the guide (i haven't read that far ahead)?
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post #11 of 31
10/31/05 at 9:54am
You'll be amazed how comprehensive the guide is. I strongly advise you to read the whole thing (and some more) before starting, so you have a clear idea of what you're doing.

Setting up the bootloader is the very last thing you do because prior to that point your system is not really bootable. You can stop/resume easily as long as its not in-between a compile Ie boot the livecd, set up the drives and misc configs, chroot in, bootstrap the system. Shut down if need be. Boot back up, do a few preliminary things to resume the session (like copying over the resolver cache, IIRC, and chrooting in again) and off you go with a system base compile. You can shut down again if you want. Now configure the kernel and compile it (compiling a kernel from scratch is 6 minutes on a 3.2GHz P4 with a -j2 flag; you'll spend more time actually configuring it ). Finally, set up some necessary system tools (like a cron manager, etc.) and you're off to the bootloader. Once the bootloader is done, you can boot the system without the CD and start installing all the apps you need.
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post #12 of 31
10/31/05 at 4:56pm
Thread Starter 
if i start installing it and stop halfway through (installing dual boot with windows), i'll still be able to boot into windows right?
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post #13 of 31
11/3/05 at 2:42pm
Of course. You don't touch (if ever) the MBR until the bootloader installation stage.
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post #14 of 31
11/3/05 at 7:38pm
Thread Starter 
ok sweet. i have a break this weekend, i think i'll be able to do it then. i'll let you all know how it goes.
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post #15 of 31
11/3/05 at 8:31pm
Yup, get home Friday afternoon, set up the initial config, get bootstrapping going and go get loaded Remember one thing, though: "don't drink and su"
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post #16 of 31
11/3/05 at 10:07pm
I am using Knoppix CD linux that runs on a cd and not on the hard drive. I am at a coffee shop typing out this message on a wireless connection provided free of charge and drinking a cup of coffee. I don't have to put it on the hard drive and can use it werever. No chance of getting a virus that will ruin XP (which is on my hard drive). You can save the setup on a thumb drive and download stuff on the thumb drive as well. No installation neccisary.
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post #17 of 31
11/3/05 at 10:09pm
You must enjoy the seek & read times of an optical drive!
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post #18 of 31
11/3/05 at 11:16pm
It takes awhile to boot but from then on its as fast or faster than xp. Lots of memory and 2mb L2 cache does wonders for DVD version of Knoppix 4.0
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post #19 of 31
11/4/05 at 4:59pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmarkin
Yup, get home Friday afternoon, set up the initial config, get bootstrapping going and go get loaded Remember one thing, though: "don't drink and su"
lol.....

I want to configure my kernal to use the suspend2-sources, but when do i select this? do i use this instead of gentoo-sources? or do i add it as package later or what? this isnt really covered in the handbook.

also, when do i configure in options on cpu throttling and undervolting (can i undervolt).

i have another question about filesystems but i posted it in a new thread because i think its something a lot of noobs will want to read
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post #20 of 31
11/4/05 at 7:20pm
You should get the 'core' system up and running first and then start fiddling with CPU frequency scaling and suspending later. Those are covered in other guides, such as the Gentoo power management guide.
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