Linux? - Page 2

OK I didn't read all the posts, but you asked if people had linux installed on sager laptops and yes I do. I have Ubuntu running (dual boot, I am stuck in windows world for work ). The install goes very smooth, but the first run can't handle the intel hda so it hangs on hotplug. Once I turned off the sound in the bios it booted fine then I just blacklisted the snd_hda_intel driver, and turned the sound back on in the bios and all is good. This of course means the sound doesn't work. I haven't tried the webcam, or PCMCIA or the sd media slot.

well, there is a new version of openoffice, version 2 that came out recently and is much better IMO than the old version. you should try it before you knock it.

i dont think you understand what open document is. it is a set of file formats that are used by the major non-MS office apps like open office, koffice, abiword, and others. it gives smaller file sizes than MS's office formats and is just as good or better in every way. it is not an inferior technology to MS's and the only reason why MS wont adopt it is because they want to keep their monopoly on the market.

No, an open document is not "better" or "as good". An open document is simply a non proprietary document built for open sourced productivity software. The reason people are looking into open documents is that they don't want to be locked in with a single software supplier. Bottom line..cash.

Of course MS won't adopt it,they're a business, they make money. Its not a question of Monopoly. Why doesn't ID software give away its code so that every game has graphics as cool as those found in Doom 3? They don't, they'll license it to those who want to use it. Even then, they don't have to. If they want to keep it for themselves 'cause they developed it and their games are better for it while others are playing "catch-up", so be it.

*sighs* I really shouldnt fan the flames, but "OpenDocument" (note capitals) is a specific format, defined by OASIS its a XML format similar to Microsoft's, but free and open. Its obviously pretty good since it (as mentioned above)scared microsoft into agreeing to openup their own XML schemas after several governments decided ODF was a better alternative for their own use, largley because it is open and therefore cinstituents can use whatever system they choose to read documents encoded in it.
Its also funny that you chose ID software as an example of a company that "protects" their sources, since they GPL their code after a few years as a matter of policy.
For the people in this thread looking to learn about linux, one of the best ways to learn in my experence is to get the O'Reilly desk refrence Linux in a Nutshell to get started, and look around online, especially in your distribution's forums for specific informaton about your hardware and configurations. O'Reilly books rule.

I know ID has given its Quake 1 code to the public domain, they still license the rest, what's your point? Like I said, they can license it, they can even give it away (a new game using the Quake 1 engine won't be real competition against the newer engines anyway) but they don't have to give it and it doesn't make them "evil" if they don't. If you want more examples of gaming companies giving away their code just go to http://www.the-underdogs.org/

So you're agreeing with what I'm saying?

I also knew that it was XML based. So? Open documents are, like I said, non proprietary docs. I never said open documents are bad, I'm just saying that its not "better" than microsoft simply for being open sourced.

Id has GPLed everything up through Quake 3 now, one generation behind current. Also as much as I love HOTU , thats abandonware, not open sourced, its in a legal grey area. There is no one or no will to enforce ownership, but its not (with some exceptions) technically free nor open souce.
As for it not being better than Microsoft's simply because it is an open standard (regardless of being implimented in open source programs), that IS the feature it was typically being considered for. As Massachusetts CIO Peter Quinn said:
"government is creating history at a rapidly increasing rate, and all documents we save must be accessible to everybody, without having to use 'closed' software to open them now and in the future."
Also note that Microsoft rushing to get their formats approved as an open standard is an admission that, beyond any technical merits, openness IS a desirable feature that their formats are lacking.
(pardon the thread hijack underway)

I wasn't aware Quake 2 and 3 were GPL as well, doesn't really change anything...so what's your point?

MS has created the standard. Its the most used and now people are starting to raise concerns about being forced into buying MS Office if you use .doc or .ppt as they're proprietary documents. At least that's the politician version...Microsoft will open its documents and presumably alleviate these concerns but really what politicians care about is to save a buck. By using GPL productivity software you save quite a bit. I'm not saying that's bad, but I don't believe that "open" docs are better simply for being open. I also don't believe Microsoft's move will change anything. In the long run its the best integrated, best supported and better featured software that'll win users.

Just to touch a bit on this, I ordered a 5720 and installed Gentoo Linux on it. I haven't used Windows in about 4 years now besides on friend's computers. Linux for *me* is just more stable and a better desktop. I could go into reasons, but for every point I'll have I'm sure some Windows fan will reply with a reason why it's not valid. :P

Anyway, I skimmed here and saw someone saying how the network card they had wasn't detected out of the box in Windows. The 5720 has this same problem in Linux. What surpised me was it was far eaiser to get the wireless card working then the wired. But there is a reason for this, on mine and on yours. The nForce came out after the version of Windows your using was most likly released. The 5720 also is using a network card that is pretty new and not yet supported fully in the kernel. Lukly this they are one of the few (but growing) companies that have linux real working drivers.

As for talk about Microsoft 'creating THE standard'.. that's the PROBLEM. You can't just create a stanard like Microsoft has been getting away with. There are boards that decide what a standard is so data can work together. If I have a file on my Windows machine, I should be able to view this file and edit it just the same on my Unix machine, my Mac, my PDA, even my VAX if I really wanted to! It's just data. If I want MS Office because I like the features, that's great. But I should not be locked into that format and have to pay MS just to view and edit a file *I* created. Nor should my friend have to pay MS just because I'm sending him a file that I created in MS Office.

ASCII is an example of a true standard. ASCII says.. A is A... B is B.. etc..

.doc is an example of just the other direction, it is no where close to a standard, 'widely used', 'popular', or 'cool' does not make something a standard. If Microsoft went belly up tomorrow, all the .doc files would be worthless and could never be opened in another program. If it was really open, 20, 30, 50 or 100 years from now you could still access your own data with out having to dig out that old copy of XP Office on your now footrest of a P4.

Doesn't Open Office already read .doc?