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Need some serious advice...

post #1 of 40
4/13/06 at 5:43pm
Thread Starter 
Well, It's in the title...

I do major graphics work for a living along with being a private IT...I USE the AW 7700 laptop to the fullest and now it's failed on me yet again and this time i've been lied to by AW so, Im considdering filing a class action lawsuit.

My Alienware 7700 had an overheat problem again(A problem that was supposidly fixed the first time and then the SECOND time) and this time it fried my graphics card. This happened last week on Wednesday...

I called AW as usual, got a very nice guy and was told the following (this is in regards to my notes)

Yes sir, we have the 6800 in stock and It will be at your door in 3-5 days.

Tuesday Rolls around...(I've allready lost some money because my laptop hasn't been up to par so, that aside...) I call again.

Sir, At this time the 6800 is not in stock, I apologize...There is nothing we can do at this time. If you wanted to upgrade to a 6800 Ultra this is entirely possible.

So I call back again Wednesday to verify the previous day and supply a credit card #.

No sir, what you were told yesterday is mistaken, we are not allowing upgrades for your system and we cannot fix this issue. I will see what we can do and call back before friday to have your situation looked at. This is because by Friday we may no longer be carrying the 6800go video card and the Ultra may be sent to you for free.

So...I call back today. (Thursday).

Sir, what you've been told is not only possible but, we are not even allowed to considder upgrading your graphics card on this system.

~~~~~

Well, in regards to the above and the process of finding out I cannot upgrade nor have a feasable laptop I've lost a great sum of income. Not only has it been squandered but, i've been lied to on MULTIPLE occasions.

Not only have I been lied to 3/4x in the last week, I've essentially lost my current liveleyhood.

To me, this is not only totally unnaceptable but, I''ve allready discussed this with my lawyer and wanted to gather from the community my options.

So far, my laptop has physically only recieved about 6months of use from me over the past year...I do have a backup but, it's not capable of rendering as my Alienware was...Bottom line is I'm losing money because of this.

Essentially I'm asking what are my options...I've called and been lied to (Bottomline), I'm losing money on a daily basis and the only thing alienware can tell me is they will have NO 6800s in stock until the end of the month and refuse to allow me to buy a 6800Ultra...Literally that's 3 weeks = $3/4,000

I can allready guarentee with the above this is the ABSOLUTE last time I reccomend alienware to any of my 40+ clients and this laptop is most likely going out my window based on pure/utter principal

Any Advice is welcome. Ty
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post #2 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:03pm
This forum is not the place to talk about lawsuits and won't be allowed for long. Have you tried private messaging one of the AW reps here? They are very good and usually get very fast results with definite answers. Click below...

Alienware-Steve
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post #3 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:07pm
Thread Starter 
If you read the above Im simply asking advice on what I should be doing next...I essentially have no livelyhood for the next 3ish week and no laptop to speak of...Any advice on what I should/could be doing is much welcome.
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post #4 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:18pm
While it sucks that you aren't getting any straight answers, you really should PM AW Steve through the link that Flappy provided. But to come on here and threaten class action lawsuits, etc, isn't going to be well received. If I were one of your clients and you gave me the excuse that you can't do your job because your laptop failed (and you don't have any other way to work), I'd be looking to employ someone else. Should always have back up plans as hardware failures are inevitable.
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post #5 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:25pm
Have you sent the machine back to AW? I did not see that info in the original post. Even if you have sent it back, send a message to AW-Steve via the link in my previous post and he will likely be able to speed up your service. In the meantime, you could try building a cheap desktop to work on...at least you could get a little work done right?

I don't see any grounds for a lawsuit, other than being confused, AW hasn't done anything wrong. They have not refused to help you as far as I can tell. Unfortunately, it will take time to fix.
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post #6 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:28pm
If you've got a backup machine, as you should if you rely on them for business, you'll have difficulty demonstrating damages that include loss of income. The extent of damages you're likely to be able to pursue would be limited to the cost of the system. You will no doubt pay a lawyer much in excess of that amount to deal with the case.

As for the *lies*, you will have to prove they lied to you intentionally in order to harm you, and that's very difficult to prove. Fraud is a tough case to prove.

The problem with sending you a 6800 Ultra is that Alienware only installs that on a motherboard revision that originally comes with the Ultra, so in order to upgrade you'd need to send the unit to Miami and have them rebuild the system. I think if you look in the Sager forum, I believe there is a company that will perform this upgrade on AW computers, but it voids your warranty and is very expensive due to the motherboard cost.

I'm really sorry to hear you're having repeated issues. All I can say is that the warranty states if Alienware can't resolve your issues after a reasonable amount of attempted repairs you're entitled to a replacement system, or a full refund at Alienware's discretion.

Your best bet at this point is to PM Alienware-Steve, or AlienRichard here on the forums and see if they can't get ahold of a 6800go and expidite it's shipment to you. If they can it might be worth it for you to buy a tube of Arctic Silver 5 heat compound to put on the heatsink for the video card, and that'll significantly cut the running temperatures of the hardware.

Best of luck.
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post #7 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zelly
While it sucks that you aren't getting any straight answers, you really should PM AW Steve through the link that Flappy provided. But to come on here and threaten class action lawsuits, etc, isn't going to be well received. If I were one of your clients and you gave me the excuse that you can't do your job because your laptop failed (and you don't have any other way to work), I'd be looking to employ someone else. Should always have back up plans as hardware failures are inevitable.
Zelly Bud, I do...But, this is my main...Im a private IT/GFX designer...I use Dreamweaver...Adobe...4/5 other programs at once on this machine...The other machine I have simply cannot handle it...Thus why its my backup not my main.

You have to understand this just didn't happen over a week, this happened 3 months ago and my laptop was in depot for a month...I've just had it back for 2 months and the same problem occured.

Beyond that, It may have sounded like a threat, I'm simply at my minds end. It's not about getting a straight answer, It's more or less about integrity. I apologize if it looks/sounds like a threat but, I honestly don't have the money to put on a new system that can handle...what I do.

This companies integrity in my eyes has been blown entirely by the above.

I appreciate the advice and Ty.
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post #8 of 40
4/13/06 at 6:32pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammerhead
If you've got a backup machine, as you should if you rely on them for business, you'll have difficulty demonstrating damages that include loss of income. The extent of damages you're likely to be able to pursue would be limited to the cost of the system. You will no doubt pay a lawyer much in excess of that amount to deal with the case.

As for the *lies*, you will have to prove they lied to you intentionally in order to harm you, and that's very difficult to prove. Fraud is a tough case to prove.

The problem with sending you a 6800 Ultra is that Alienware only installs that on a motherboard revision that originally comes with the Ultra, so in order to upgrade you'd need to send the unit to Miami and have them rebuild the system. I think if you look in the Sager forum, I believe there is a company that will perform this upgrade on AW computers, but it voids your warranty and is very expensive due to the motherboard cost.

I'm really sorry to hear you're having repeated issues. All I can say is that the warranty states if Alienware can't resolve your issues after a reasonable amount of attempted repairs you're entitled to a replacement system, or a full refund at Alienware's discretion.

Your best bet at this point is to PM Alienware-Steve, or AlienRichard here on the forums and see if they can't get ahold of a 6800go and expidite it's shipment to you. If they can it might be worth it for you to buy a tube of Arctic Silver 5 heat compound to put on the heatsink for the video card, and that'll significantly cut the running temperatures of the hardware.

Best of luck.

In regards to the issues, this is the 4th issue of the same event reacurring.

My motherboard was JUST replaced 4 months ago when the 6800Ultras were coming out in full force. I have the revision.

Simply, they can't get them until the end of the month and I'm backed into a corner.

I did invest in the compound as a Technician told me to the first time...

I literally havn't had this thing in my posession for more than 6 months in the past year...I guess I should've figured it would go down again and start investing in a new system but, this is utterly rediculous.
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post #9 of 40
4/14/06 at 12:18am
All I can tell you is what's already been mentioned, PM the reps and when you call AW, ask to speak with managers or supervisors. I didn't have much luck with first level tech support or customer service.
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post #10 of 40
4/14/06 at 4:31pm
I’ll prob get bad karma for this, but I was thinking the same… I would NEVER spend 4k on a notebook unless it was my dream computer, this was supposed to be my dream computer, but it just dose not perform.

http://alienware.com/product_detail_...KU-DEFAULT#sub (Alienware.com)

with 6 month old drivers for the 7800GTX, and the extreme down clocking my Aurura m7700 does when on battery power (that cant be shut off) we are not getting these results…
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post #11 of 40
4/14/06 at 4:46pm
ummm man talk of legal action is frowned upon on these boards. if you want to do that its your choice but just a friendly little heads up that talk of it will likely lead to trouble here.
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post #12 of 40
4/14/06 at 5:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by marker01
Wow! Well, there are plenty of lawyers that will file class action law suites against notebook manufactures that overheat, but most of those cases are because the system is out of warranty.

I’ll prob get bad karma for this, but I was thinking the same… I would NEVER spend 4k on a notebook unless it was my dream computer, this was supposed to be my dream computer, but it just dose not perform.

http://alienware.com/product_detail_...KU-DEFAULT#sub (Alienware.com)

with 6 month old drivers for the 7800GTX, and the extreme down clocking my Aurura m7700 does when on battery power (that cant be shut off) we are not getting these results…
Yes, there are plenty of lawyers that will file all kinds of actions, as they get paid whether the cases have merit or not. If you're judging the merit of your case by whether a lawyer will take your money, you're in for a very expensive ride.

The 7700 line has never been advertised as a laptop, but as a DTR (desktop replacement) and it's always been intended to be used plugged in. I can understand your frustration with how long it takes Alienware to certify new video drivers, but the clock down on battery is the way the base platform was designed from the word go. I suppose if you need to blame someone, Clevo would be a more appropriate target, but to expect full performance on battery for this type of computer isn't realistic.

Is your complaint with Alienware that they don't have a warning that system performance is reduced while on battery on the configurator?

Has anyone tried just using the drivers from Nvidia's website? I've always used drivers from the card manufacturers site, but my mobile system has an ATi graphics card in it, and the drivers from their website lists Alienware as one of the manufacturers the drivers are intended for. I see that the list of manufacturers for the 7800gtx go on Nvidia's site doesn't include Alienware, but does include other resellers of the platform.
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post #13 of 40
4/14/06 at 5:37pm
Man in this day and age you need to document who you talked to and their extensions and demand to talk to that person again when you call back. Alienware is in capacity to do this since I have done this before with them.

Or better yet have them give you their E-mail address. I've emailed back in forth with techs that I have talked to on the phone. Alienware isn't like most companies, all Alienware employees are given Alienware Email addresses.
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post #14 of 40
4/14/06 at 5:55pm
Yes I understand this is a desktop replacement. You can read my review, its not even close, but still one of the most powerful “Mobile PC’s” out there.

About being always plugged in… here is a RL example

HP has offered mobile PC’s with desktop processors for years, all their systems do the same thing, when you go to battery power, to autoclocks the system down to save battery life.

The big difference between HP and AW, you can turn that feature off! In fact, I bet you cant name another PC hardware manufacture that offers some form of “power saving” that cant be shut off lol.

I did expect there to be some power saving utility, but common sense tells you it can be shut off (at the price of extremely short battery life)

My BIG point, @ these prices, an average customer expects perfections… that’s all.

Yes, we have tried the drivers from nvidia.com, they don’t work… there are drivers out there that work, but none are supported

Edit: btw, they do advertise this system as a Notebook computer, not a mobile PC…

Here is one example: http://alienware.com/product_detail_...KU-DEFAULT#sub

“Aurora m7700 notebooks deliver a 17”….”

That’s all, I don’t gloat lol =))
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post #15 of 40
4/14/06 at 6:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by marker01
Yes I understand this is a desktop replacement. You can read my review, its not even close, but still one of the most powerful “Mobile PC’s” out there.

About being always plugged in… here is a RL example

HP has offered mobile PC’s with desktop processors for years, all their systems do the same thing, when you go to battery power, to autoclocks the system down to save battery life.

The big difference between HP and AW, you can turn that feature off! In fact, I bet you cant name another PC hardware manufacture that offers some form of “power saving” that cant be shut off lol.

I did expect there to be some power saving utility, but common sense tells you it can be shut off (at the price of extremely short battery life)

My BIG point, @ these prices, an average customer expects perfections… that’s all.

Yes, we have tried the drivers from nvidia.com, they don’t work… there are drivers out there that work, but none are supported

Edit: btw, they do advertise this system as a Notebook computer, not a mobile PC…

Here is one example: http://alienware.com/product_detail_...KU-DEFAULT#sub

“Aurora m7700 notebooks deliver a 17”….”

That’s all, I don’t gloat lol =))
Bummer about the drivers, that's not good news.

I also understand your point about the bios option to shut off power saving features, but are any of the laptops that offer that using desktop processors and 7800gtx's? I wouldn't be surprised if that kind of draw on the battery would do serious damage or shorten the lifespan of the battery bigtime.

Point taken, when you buy an Alienware you should be able to expect perfection. I'm not a big laptop guy, so most of my Alienware experience has been with their desktops, so in my experience I have very few complaints.

I know some people at AW, I'll email them and see if I can't find out what the deal is with the AW only drivers, and why it's taking them so long to certify and update them. I'll also ask about the power savings thing.

I probably shouldn't ask this, but has anyone tried flashing a bios from another company that carries this platform to see if it will resolve these issues? Understand that flashing the bios without AW's consent will likely void your warranty, but I'm curious to know if anybody has tried that out.
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post #16 of 40
4/14/06 at 7:58pm
try the drivers from http://www.laptopvideo2go.com/ they always work for me with my laptops and i use them on my dell with the 7800gtx where dell has horribly outdated drivers on its website too. it should work for you too....
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post #17 of 40
4/14/06 at 10:51pm
sorry to hear about your misfortune. In all honesty, we live in a society that is totally mitigated by perpetuous lawsuits. Almost anyone can slap a suit on anyone these days. Hell...if your neighbor keeps refusing to take out the garbage you can put a lien on his damn house thus preventing him from selling it, refinancing it, etc. My round-about point is that not everything in life is fair. I know you "feel" screwed but that is really just a feeling. Going through the steps with a class action lawsuit probably won't make you "feel" better, though you IMAGINE it will. But imagine the painstaking toll it will take on you mentally, financially, time allocated to the cause, etc. Would it be really worth it? Or would be be worth it to think " hey I got a bum computer, the company is not responding the way i think they should...alright im gonna suck up the loss and buy a new computer." I mean if you are losing 4k a month, then it is worthwhile to cut your losses and get a new computer. You can get a used xps with a 6800 for very cheap. Just some thoughts to consider.
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post #18 of 40
4/14/06 at 11:06pm
yeah also if you do try to file a lawsuit you will have to spend alot of $$$$ to eveng get a lawyer and if you want a good lawyer/attorney it iwll be major $$$$$$$$$$$$$, also if i am saying if you take like aw to court and it doesn't go throguh then you lost so much money right there
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post #19 of 40
4/17/06 at 2:48pm
Thread Starter 
Its not the $$$$ im worried about really...It's the principal.

They lied on the phone (Sorry sir, they were mistaken is bullshit...Thats a lie) and it's happened 3/4x ~ + that no rep on the forum has gotten back to me...I'll give it till Wed...Allready emailed PCmag and PCgamer...Hopefully it'll get published.
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post #20 of 40
4/17/06 at 3:02pm
Why are you sending pcmag and pcgamer these troubles. Every company has horror stories and you were the one out of like 100 that had it happen to them. Also don't expect that a laptop that is way better then my desktop is going to fit easily into a 13 material. Are you sending it to those magazines to get Aw embarrassed? Everyone is trying their best to help you out here any you're doing this.... Go and look at CyberP Intial review of the aurora m7700, look what happened to him, he had to send his laptop back to the depot like 3 times.......... He stayed patient didn't stop believing in alienware and look.... He has his aurora and he loves it. So stay patient and calm and good things will happen to you, Also why are you emailing it to those magazines? I'm sorry if i read your post wrong and i thought you meant it in another way.
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