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Driver without "background noise" - Page 5

post #81 of 161
7/31/06 at 4:46pm
New development: I thought of some good synonyms to describe the problem. Most noticeably, "grainy." The first result showed some promising and... very depressing news. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the link to another forum, but I found a reply for my Asus W3J. Someone else was requesting people test their monitors. Here is the reply:

"Sounds like you are talking about the sparkle effect. if thats what it is they are all like that nothing you can do. its most noticable on green and blue."

=[ The other reply, however, said it had a very solid black. So I'm still not sure if it's an isolated defect.
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post #82 of 161
7/31/06 at 7:04pm
Guys
I,m glad it turned out to be a hardware issue that is relatively easy to fix,
for the factory. Looks like they got ahold of some bad displays. If it was the
x1600 that means a whole new motherboard. Hmmm if it needed a new
motherboard I wonder if you could have talked them into popping in a shiny
new Merom for your trouble. Oh well, we will never know
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post #83 of 161
7/31/06 at 7:18pm
Well my 8202 got back from the factory with a shining new LCD screen and beautiful speckles all over it so I doubt it is the LCD screen altough they may have replaced with another faulty screen. I agree with other users: this is not a driver issue either since most of us can still se it on Linux and/or the bootscreen.

I don't know how many of you with the problem used Omega Drivers or some tweaking tools before you noticed the problem. I did (use Omega and ATITool) and don't know if it has something to do with it but I suspect it might have damaged the graphics card or that it might have left wrong settings at a very low level of configuration. Perharps there is a way of "resetting" the card to all of its factory settings. What do you think?
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post #84 of 161
7/31/06 at 9:23pm
I didn't use my laptop much before using OmegaDrivers so I don't know if maybe that messed something up. I know Omega messes with Fast Writes so you could potentially try switching that around.

According to another forum, this problem is supposedly how all laptops with X1600 Mobility are... =\ I don't know. I'm considering living with it because I have one week before I have to leave for college summer program, and I'll only be back two weeks after the program. How many people don't have this problem?
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post #85 of 161
7/31/06 at 10:38pm
Raindog_mx,

I installed Omega drivers once with fast writes enabled and a second time with fast writes disabled. Both times I had the speckles. I doubt it has anything to do with it.

Like I said earlier, my laptop can display flawlessly on an external monitor. So why are you guys still thinking it's the x1600's fault? Doesn't that mean the x1600 is working properly?
Ghiblian, you said you can display perfect images on your external monitor, correct?
So isn't the culprit something after the x1600?
So it has to be the screen itself or the connection between the screen and the x1600.
Seems like we keep going in circles here.

-Jonathan
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post #86 of 161
7/31/06 at 11:46pm
I went back and looked at the other threads and realized everyone who has confirmed that their screen is working properly all had an x1400. I don’t know anyone who has a working laptop with an x1600.

Based on everything I’ve read thus far, I think it might be the primary display output on the x1600. I think the output of the primary display is poorly shielded and allowing some electronic noise to distort the screen.

No, I take that back. That doesn’t make sense.
The LCD uses a digital signal right?
With digital signals, since every bit is either on or off, you usually either get a perfect signal or no signal at all. It takes a lot of noise to distort a digital signal.
If it was an analog signal, the “poorly shielded wiring” idea might hold some water.

Damn, this is really weird.

We know the GPU works, because it can display fine through a secondary monitor.
Yet, this problem seems to be prevalent only with x1600 GPUs!
So it’s probably not the screen either. Something that deals with the connection between the GPU and the primary display?

Crazy.

Anyone else care to speculate?

Ghiblian, where's the other forum you're reading. PM me with the address if you don't want to post it. Thanks.
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post #87 of 161
8/1/06 at 2:54am
The reason why it might still be the X1600 is that a lot of laptops from different manufacturers have this problem. And while the grainyness doesn't show up on my external monitor, it migh be due to the analog connection, or the brightness flooding out the grainyness, or the mere fact that the screen is much more vivid than the laptop screen (which might flush out the graytones of the grain).

Additionally, posts on the other form seem to blame the X1600 rather than the screen itself.
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post #88 of 161
8/1/06 at 3:12am
Good point,

But based on my experience I don’t entirely agree with you.
When I tested the laptop on the external monitor, the image was crisp and clear, without loss of detail.
If the GPU itself is garbling the image and then the analogue connection to the external monitor was “blending out” the speckles, the final image would still appear blurry and loose some detail. The chance of the analog connection blending the distorted image exactly back to the proper image without any loss of detail is very slim, if not impossible.

However, I think you might be right about it not being the screen either. I think the problem lies either on the video card’s (outside the actual GPU chip but still on the video card) output to the main LCD screen. This would explain why it is a problem common to x1600s and why the x1600 can display to an external monitor properly.
I’m pretty sure the actual GPU chip itself is functioning properly.

I’m going to go read that other forum now.

-Jonathan
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post #89 of 161
8/1/06 at 3:46am
Man,

I just read that other thread. That Geared2play.com guy is a real jerk. I can’t believe they bashed you for being unhappy about a defective product you paid for! Let me just reassure you that a grainy display is NOT normal. If your laptop was advertised as “only capable of displaying 16-bit color” or “makes photo-editing nearly impossible!” or “you’re 3D renders will look like crap!” then I wouldn’t complain. But since they advertised your laptop as capable of displaying 24-bit color, I would expect 24-bit color. If you tell your laptop to display a solid block of blue color it should display a solid block of blue color, not a sandy blue beach.

If you are unhappy with your laptop, don’t settle until you either get the problem fixed or your money back. There are plenty of laptops out there without this problem.

-Jonathan
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post #90 of 161
8/1/06 at 6:22am
I think Acer like many other companies play a numbers game. They know
what with the level of complexity built in to notebook that there will
be problem units. They know if the problem(s) is noticed people will
complain and they will fix em. I had a tech tell me that if an electronic
component is going to fail it will do so early in it's life. Sounds
reasonable. These are after all mass produced items. I'd like to
know the percentage of problem units compared to ones that
work fine out of box. If that number is high say 25% then we have a problem. It seems to me that a forum that deals with
issues with Acer laptops like ours and others give a biased
view of what percentage of units sold have display problems. How many people
reading these threads don't have this problem. Does anyone see my point?
Then again how many people don't realize they have a problem? I bet Acer is
keeping score.
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post #91 of 161
8/1/06 at 6:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghiblian
The reason why it might still be the X1600 is that a lot of laptops from different manufacturers have this problem. And while the grainyness doesn't show up on my external monitor, it migh be due to the analog connection, or the brightness flooding out the grainyness, or the mere fact that the screen is much more vivid than the laptop screen (which might flush out the graytones of the grain).

Additionally, posts on the other form seem to blame the X1600 rather than the screen itself.
Hey Ghiblian,
Just googled the Gear2Play thread. Man you showed a lot of restraint.
But you stuck to your guns. With the state of the art of LCD tech
today no one should expect noticable defects and artifacts to be
acceptable. For what we pay for these machines we should expect
a good experience. And the screen is the thing we always look at
when we use are machines. This Gear2Play guy is a jerk. I hope
all resellers aren't like him.
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post #92 of 161
8/1/06 at 9:39am
I'm sure you are right Frank. Most people probably have perfectly good displays. I guess I've let myself become disillusioned and a little discouraged from hearing about all the Acer/Asus defects (especially when that Geared2play guy said “Asus can’t help you!”). The reason I bought this laptop is because of the overwhelmingly positive reviews posted by both average users and professional journalists, most of which had nothing but praises for the 5672 x1600 graphics and screen. I’m sure if all the laptops had display issues, at least some of the reviewers would have noticed.

There is hope. I feel a lot better now.
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post #93 of 161
8/1/06 at 11:01am
Heh, yah. Problems usually are blown out of proportions when looking at forums because normally only the people who have the problems become involved in the issue. The people who don't have problems are happily enjoying themselves elsewhere without having to worry about some silly forum thread. I'm just surprised that none of the reviewers got a "defective" model.

I mainly posted to see if there was a possibility of having this laptop without having to live with the grainy screen. Obviously if that's just the way it is... I'm willing to live with it considering how amazing this laptop is otherwise, and how I could always use an external monitor for color / quality critical stuff. I can't wait til you get your laptop back, Jonathan.

Asus support has been slow in getting back to me. I doubt they'll tell me much on the technical problem that's causing this defect.
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post #94 of 161
8/1/06 at 11:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghiblian
Heh, yah. Problems usually are blown out of proportions when looking at forums because normally only the people who have the problems become involved in the issue. The people who don't have problems are happily enjoying themselves elsewhere without having to worry about some silly forum thread. I'm just surprised that none of the reviewers got a "defective" model. I mainly posted to see if there was a possibility of having this laptop without having to live with the grainy screen. Obviously if that's just the way it is... I'm willing to live with it considering how amazing this laptop is otherwise, and how I could always use an external monitor for color / quality critical stuff. I can't wait til you get your laptop back, Jonathan. Asus support has been slow in getting back to me. I doubt they'll tell me much on the technical problem that's causing this defect.
Assert yourself with them they won't give you any technical details unless you insist they do. A lot of this tech stuff is easily understood by people like us. If you find out anything please let us know. P.S no matter what idiots like Queer2Play say graininess is not normal on a LCD panel. The technology has mutured way beyond that. There, I said it,WTF
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post #95 of 161
8/1/06 at 11:45am
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post #96 of 161
8/1/06 at 12:09pm
But you should remember, that average user is an idiot (at least in States)... Just kidding...
You came to the same point as we did couple of weeks ago - even the test with external monitor was done before... Why don't you read the other threads first?
BTW, I've started two threads (here and on notebookreview.com) to check if there is a lot of people with this problem (it showed first with 8204 only) and if there is any regularity with bios version/driver/screen type/build date, but those threads didn't show anything like this so far...
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post #97 of 161
8/1/06 at 1:17pm
I didn't kn0w about the other threads. All this forum stuff is brand new to me.
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post #98 of 161
8/1/06 at 5:34pm
I chickened out.
I lost my nerve.
I just couldn’t do it.

My laptop was all packaged up and ready to be shipped out to Acer and at the last minute, I had a change of heart. Actually, it was after the last minute. Apparently the FedEx guy had already stopped by to pick up my package but I was away from my desk at the moment. Lucky for me. I decided to return it to the reseller and get a full refund. I called CDW and within minutes I had an RMA #. I’ll have to pay the shipping, but I’m OK with that.

It was the thought of sending my Laptop to Acer and getting it back in worse condition than it was sent. I’ve read too many horror stories on these threads. My fear maybe unfounded, but I just don’t feel comfortable sending my Laptop away.
I figure I can still get any laptop I want since I’ll have my money back. I can buy any manufacturer’s laptop from any reseller.

On a side note, dealing with CDW was nothing short of a pleasure.

-Jonathan
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post #99 of 161
8/1/06 at 7:30pm
I wrote this to Acer

Problem Type & Description:
Select any of the following options that apply:
Screen/Display
How may we assist you?
My computer has the "background noise" issue clearly described by many users in this thread: http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=51897
I can see tiny dots of slightly light color scattered evenly everywhere on the screen. It happens even when booting another operating system (linux from a live cd). I already got an LCD screen replacement but it didn't fix the issue. Please tell me what to tell to the repairman so we can fix this. I believe you should know the solution because I don't want to sent it back to be serviced and get another new screen thah won't solve a thing because that would be an expensive waste for Acer and me. Thank you.

They answered:


Mr De La Pena,

According to the information you have provided us with, the only determination we can draw from that is probably since the screen has already been replaced, have the Mainboard Replaced on this Unit, Obiously this will have to be done by An authorized Acer Service Center.

Thank you,

Acer's Technical Support.
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post #100 of 161
8/1/06 at 7:48pm
I did read the rest of the thread. It seemed to be all about drivers and stuff. I might have missed the stuff we were going over.

Anyways, Jonathan, are you buying a new laptop now? The same one?

No matter how much of a meany that guy was, he does know a lot more about this stuff than we do. I wonder when I'm getting my Vista beta 2 CD back...

"Concluded the grainyness thing you guys were complaining abotu had nothing to do with the screen at all. Swapped the screens on the z96j and z70va (known not to have this) and problem remained on the z96j while the z70va with z96j screen was fine. Problem is caused by the driver. How does this relate to the w3j or any other ati x1600 driven machine. Well the w3j has the same exact complaint the z96j and the s96j has. I guess i can say i found the cause but not the solution. I belive the solution would be with a different driver"
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