Point of Linux?

For the average home user the only thing it really offers is "free".

For anyone above the home user it provides a stable platform for hosting, programing, gaming, and anything a windows system can do, but faster and more efficiently

-Leon

to make seablade happy i'll repharse that question as now that seablade is happy i can proceed to answer the question. YES. There are many advantages. For starters its all free software, so you no longer need to march to best buy and make your wallet thinner just so you can pick up a program or 2, or the OS itself for that matter. One big advantage over windows is SECURITY. Yes it is possible to keep a safe and secure windows environment, but most people don't, either because they don't know how, aren't aware of the available tools, or are simply too lazy. In linux viruses, spyware, and all that junk is not something that you need to worry about. All you need is a nice setup for iptables (the integrated linux firewall) and have a secure root password, and thats it, you're done. Never do you have to scan with an AV or spyware remover. Another major advantage is custmization. You can rebuild (or build from scratch) any given distribution entirely for YOUR needs. You can compile the kernel for your specific hardware and install only the programs you'll use, and nothing you won't. Windows is built to run on as many sets of hardware as possible, and so are some linux distros (like Fedora or Ubuntu), but unlike with XP you have the freedom to build your own kernel removing support for all the components that you don't own....and in the end because the system is built for your system on your system...it will run FASTER. With a proper gentoo config you'll be flying faster than you ever thought possible. Flexibility extends beyond the kernel, beyond your choice of software, it goes to the GUI (as a home user i am sure you wont be stuck in text mode) as well. In XP you pretty much have 1 gui, ok, you also have the option of using a shell based on fluxbox..but thats as far as your options go. In Linux you can pick and customize every single aspect about your GUI...be it you pick KDE, Gnome, XFCE, Fluxbox, Enlighgtenment, Rat Poison, IceWM, Mezzo......etc. there are other benefits, but you need to use linux to appreciate those...but for the sake of this thread i'll stick with the 3 big ones...flexibility (which can lead to potential speed gain), freedom (as in speech and beer), and security. as for the ultimate question "is there a point of linux?" i don't even know how to answer that. I would say not exactly. its just an extremely flexible OS which can be customized and used on anything from PDAs (Familiar Project) and iPods (iPod Linux), to Media boxes (movix), desktops, servers, and everything in between. With linux, its easy to make it what YOU want to make out of it....nothing more, nothing less. That said, I've been dual booting for years but i've migrated to linux now on 2 of my 3 machines because of Vista arriving soon....it has some built in DRM and other "security features" which I am not happy about....so screw vista and give me linux. my only machine that still runs XP is not capable of running vista (p3 1133mhz, shared video, 1gb ram)

by default, no windows "EXE" will run on a linux system. just so we are clear. However games can be ran via Cedega and some other basic apps can be ran via Wine. YET....you'll not feel compelled...EVER to commit a crime against humanity and use a windows program on linux.

Many of the programs you use every day in windows (life firefox) have linux builds as well, so it will work just the way you remember it. Most other programs have fantastic alternatives which are different, but in most cases just as good as what you got used to in the windows world. So in teh end you'll be able to do the same exact things under linux as you were under windows.
here are is a very limited list of examples:
Task -- Linux App
Web Browser -- Firefox, Opera, Konqueror, Epiphany
Email Client -- Thunderbird, Evolution, Kmail
Photo Editing -- Gimp (also has a windows build)
IM -- Gaim (has win build), Kopete
Office -- OpenOffice 2 (also available in windows)
WinAMP -- XMMS
WinDVD -- Totem-Xine

.... as you can see....everything is still quite possible, in many cases with the very same app you used in Windows.

The Seablade is pleased.... HehHeh, glad to see you are learning ABF At any rate ABF has done a rather good job of describing possibilities to consider, so I would ask, what is the software you need(Or Think you need as the case may be) to run under Windows? Seablade

I don't get these threads at all. It's like asking what's the point of tap water when you can just buy some Evian at the supermarket.

its my favorite

Seeing that you're even asking about linux indicates that you're interested in a little more than being handed an OS and using it. Then spending a great amount of time scanning, securing, and patching your box so you can use it to get some email or find out the weather for the weekend.

I'd say one of the biggest advantages of running Linux is dependability. Once you get it set up its pretty much stable. Like others have said, no malware or virus will bother you. No .EXE will exacute. Plus there is the advantage of being completely free and the hardware requirements are no where near what Vista will use.

Customization is another key. You can definately turn your machine into YOUR machine. Meaning that you can tweak until your hearts content. Your desktop can be as simple or as complicated as you want. You can run a truely bare bones workstation and only have the applications you want. On the other hand, you can find some very cool specialized apps in Linux.
When you get to the server level of linux, you are basically runnig a form of unix. Its rock stable and very robust. It really takes allot to bring down a properly configured server. There are also a ton server apps that can also be built for free.

If your interested in Kubuntu, I would encourage you to check out my How-to. It's geared for the new user and has helped many users cross over to the linux way of doing things.
http://www.linuxloader.com/modules.p...howpage&pid=28

PDR60

I like this thread. I'm also a noob looking into linux, are there any guides out there that explain the differences between all the terms you guys throw out there? Like ubuntu and gnome and kde and then you can ubuntu running with gnome and etc etc and when you don't know what the stuff means, it's just a bunch of words. It's like me telling you that sassafrass and cilantro and far superior to salt and pepper. The problem is that you already know what salt and pepper are, where to get them, how to use them, but perhaps you don't know what sassafrass and cilantro are. If I just say the word cilantro, it doesn't tell you what cilantro looks like, why it is better, what it replaces, what it needs to be used with, where to get it, etc etc. Sorry if my analogy is lame, but I'm still largely confused in the linux department.

Ok first and foremost there is a LOT of good reading in the newbie learning resource thread(Sticky thread above)

Secondly a lot of what people use to determine their linux environment come down to two things...

A Distribution, or Distro, you will note ABF mdae this distinction above for my benefit because many people confuse distributions with linux itself. A Distro, is linux packaged together in a certain way by someone for whatever purpose. Examples would probably explain a bit better, and include Ubuntu, Fedora, Gentoo, Suse, Sourcemage, Arch, etc.

The other thing that affects this is what Window Manager you are running. In Linux a GUI is provided by the XWindows System, however XWindows uses different window managers to provide the full 'look and feel' of it. XWindows itself is the low level processes of controlling mouse interactions, display to screen, etc. The Window Manager is what you deal with as a user, handle window resizing, moving, icons, etc. Examples include Gnome, KDE, E, XFCE, FluxBox, etc.

As you can see there is a LARGE level of possible customization in linux, which is what makes it so difficult for newcomers as neither Mac nor Windows has anywhere close to this level of customization, and there are a lot of options to sort through as a result that may seem cryptic at first. Take your time, understand it will take a long time to get really used to linux, but when you do system administration is MUCH easier on linux than Windows, and Much more easy to make detailed changes and customization than Mac has(VERY General system admin is easy on a mac)

Seabldae

Somehow I musta skimmed over that sticky. I'll go read that. Basically though, what you're saying is you have a low-level UNIX OS like "Ubuntu, Fedora, Gentoo, Suse, Sourcemage, Arch, etc." and then what you actually SEE in the GUI can be altered by one of these "Gnome, KDE, E, XFCE, FluxBox, etc." Correct? So, If I just installed Ubuntu with no Gnome or KDE, would I be in a command-line interface or is XWindows built-in and a kinda boring low-level GUI?

NO!(Sorry this is becoming a pet peeve of mine Specificly NO to this part.... What you listed there is DISTRIBUTIONS. They are NOT the OS. They are linux that is packaged in a certain way to give a certain experience or for a certain use. This is what many people confuse, when they do linux vs windows comparisons, they are comparing the Distributions 95 percent of the time, not the OS. However now that i have gotten that out of the way.... This is pretty close to correct if I am understanding your intent correctly. But maybe the response to the rest will help clarify this a bit... XWindows is a peice of software, just like Quicken, Baldur's Gate etc. What it does though is manages your input devices, monitors, video cards, etc in a way that allows for a more graphical interface. There are libs out there that do this as well, though typically they arent used for windowing, and there are alternatives to XWindows as well, though they are not very common and usually not open source. The Window Manager acts by making calls to XWindows to draw its graphical elements, but the window manager, as the name suggests, manages all those graphical elements and presents(Or attempts to) them in a way that is easily understood by the user, and handles things like window size, movement, mouse interactions(What happens when you click, scroll etc) as well as a small variety of other things. Generally when you are describing the 'look and feel' of your GUI, you are describing the Window Manager. Seablade

So in response to the NO: what exactly is the OS then? Is it just straight up "Linux"? What would be the difference between a distro and the OS (which I don't even know exactly what is yet)? I do understand that different distro's are not completely different operating systems, merely different spins on the same one, I might even understand how it works correctly just am using wrong terminology.

Yep. I am afraid I am bad at explaining things with regards to this so maybe someone can come in and translate The Distro is the Linux OS packaged together with certain software packages to create a unique environment. For example, most desktop distros package a Window Manager, XWindows, FireFox, and a variety of other desktop software packages together. Also many distros will have their own 'package management' solution that lets you install new software easier than compiling it from source. Gentoo for example has portage that automates compiling software from source and tweaking it to your individual system. Debian and debian based distributions(Such as Ubuntu) use apt, which is a very nice system and extermely easy to install precompiled binaries on. There is also the RPM (Red Hat Package Manager) used by, you guessed it, Fedora, RHEL, Suse, etc. There have been attempts to improve this with yum and apt for rpm etc with mixed results. It can be confusing to install an RPM due to 'dependency hell' which those improvements attempt to address. This is most likely the case, but the correct terminology for this on the web is important since so many people learn about linux through the web. Seablade

a distro is the OS bundled with a collection of apps, and set up in a particular way to meet the needs/wants of the person/people who package/maintain that distro. From Wikipedia: [paraphrase] A Linux distribution is a version of Linux with other assorted programs. Distro maintainers/developers assemble and test the software before releasing their distribution. There are currently over three hundred Linux distribution projects in active development, revising and improving their respective distributions. [/paraphrase] Edit: that wiki article is a good read if you want to understand this. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_distribution

I think the confusion is a result of the fact that the linux kernel is not tied to a gui like the the nt kernel is.

MS bundled a graphical system on top of the nt kernel forcing users to use a graphical user interface. The linux kernel, on the other hand, runs completely independent of xwindows so a gui is not needed.

As a result, the windows operating system has to include the gui where linux you're essentially just talking about the kernel. I'm even a bit confused.

So, if I were to install just a straight-up Linux, no distro of any kind, that would result in like what? A less than 100mb OS with command-line interface?

I don;t know how much you'd have to strip the kernel down, but you could fit it on a floppy disk.

http://www.toms.net/rb/

straight up linux is the kernel. thats it. you can't install just the kernel and leave it at that. you ahve to at least install a bootloader, hotplug or udev for plug-n-play hardware, as well as some other programs to even get it to boot and be usable on your system....so even just that package of 5 or 6 programs is already technically A DISTRO. And yes, you'll pretty much have a text interface and it'd be less than 30mb (Well, actually depends on the size of your given kernel configuration). Such is available if you install gentoo and follow the steps in teh handbook but dont go beyond that with installing other programs and xorg and a wm.