NOTE: THIS PROBLEM HAS BEEN SOLVED. Dell developed a process to weed out bad cards from their production line. As such, no "bad" graphics boards should be shipping out from this point forward (Mar. 10th or so, 2004).
I WILL KEEP THIS EDITED TO REFLECT ANY NEW DEVELOPMENTS!
In this thread, I would like to keep everything as on-topic as possible. Let's keep it as relevant as possible to the problem at hand.
Please add whatever information you can to this thread and I will update this post accordingly.
I am now fairly certain that this whole mess is the result of some bad cards that are failing to operate at the deisgned spec. The evidence pretty much supports that downclocking the card has a direct effect on how long your system will operate before it crashes in a 3d application.
Here's the information we've collected over the past couple of days regarding this problem:
Game Issues:
This is a tricky problem. If you indeed have a defective board, ALL games REGARDLESS of how complex will freeze within minutes of play. However, there are a few games that appear to freeze EVEN IF you have a known good GPU board. They are:
People at Dell involved (PLEASE report additional names. Let's help keep Dell honest!):
POTENTIAL WORKAROUND!
I've found a potential workaround for this problem, I'm testing it now. It involves the use of Powerstrip (www.entechtaiwan.com). Implement/test this fix at your own risk!
UPDATE: After a furious bout with Battlefield 1942, I still experienced a lockup. Some people are reporting that even cranking down their Core/Mem timings as low as Powerstrip will let them, they are still experiencing lockups. downclocking 10mhz Core/Mem allows me to play indefinitely with a negligible performance hit (I don't even see one, though i'm sure a benchmark will reveal otherwise). For some, this workaround works 100%, but your mileage may vary. Bottom line, if your unit freezes on 3d games in general, regardless of title, you likely have a bad GPU board.
ITEMS OF NOTE WITH THIS WORKAROUND:
WHAT YOU SHOULD DO IF YOU HAVE AN INSPIRON XPS THAT LOCKS UP IN 3D APPLICATIONS:
Support numbers for Dell Tech support:
I WILL KEEP THIS EDITED TO REFLECT ANY NEW DEVELOPMENTS!
In this thread, I would like to keep everything as on-topic as possible. Let's keep it as relevant as possible to the problem at hand.
Please add whatever information you can to this thread and I will update this post accordingly.
I am now fairly certain that this whole mess is the result of some bad cards that are failing to operate at the deisgned spec. The evidence pretty much supports that downclocking the card has a direct effect on how long your system will operate before it crashes in a 3d application.
Here's the information we've collected over the past couple of days regarding this problem:
- According to THIS THREAD, THE NEW INSPIRON 9100 IS ALSO AFFECTED!
- Threads discussing this issue are THIS ONE, here, here and here
- Limited to 3d/GPU (Prime95's torture test runs without failure for hours)
- Problem occurs during intensive 3D, exhibiting as either screen corruption or a hard lockup.
- Occurs on both the pre-installed XP config and rebuilt configs.
- Occurs on all driver revisions including the pre-installed, support.dell.com drivers (one rev newer), OmegaCorner.com drivers, Catalyst 4.2 and 4.3's with hacked install INFs.
- Occurs in any 3D app, from low-tech games like Shadowbane to the Mother Nature benchmark in 3dmark03.
- Turning PowerPlay to "Balanced" alleviates the issue, albeit with a 50-75% framerate hit
- Raising the XPS unit off the surface of the desk delays or prevents the problem (Thermal?)
- Using I8kFangui to turn fans to MAX does not resolve the issue (Fangui offers only limited functionality with the XPS)
- Stock VCORE and MEM speeds of the Mobility 9700 are: 445.50/263.25 Mhz respectively. Matches this"first look" at hardocp.
- One person was talked through taking his XPS apart over the phone! AND he has an in-home service warranty. Customer rep claimed the fans were "user replaceable"... DON'T DO IT IF YOU ARE ASKED!
- Dell has recommended that users who have a bad unit NOT opt for a replacement at this time, as the new unit will likely suffer the same problem. Wait for a fix from Dell.
- Downclocking the video card SOMETIMES ALLEVIATES this problem, albeit at a varying performance hit proportional to the amount you have to downclock. Using Powerstrip, you can USUALLY downclock it far enough until it is stable. However, some games will lock up invariably (Call of Duty, SOF2)
- Dell apparently does have GPU units available to dispatch for those who opted for at-home service!
- DISALBING HYPERTHREADING IN THE BIOS APPEARS TO ALSO "FIX" THIS ISSUE WITH CERTAIN GAMES! (Call of Duty). It does NOT cure the issue, however.
- Xstatic reports that a windows watchdog log indicates the driver is being stuck in an endless loop, possibly because of a hardware failure. It names the Radeon driver by name.
Game Issues:
This is a tricky problem. If you indeed have a defective board, ALL games REGARDLESS of how complex will freeze within minutes of play. However, there are a few games that appear to freeze EVEN IF you have a known good GPU board. They are:
- Midnight Club II
- Call of Duty (DEMO ONLY! Full game appears to be ok. For the demo version, disabling Hyperthreading in the BIOS appears to fix it)
- Soldier of Fortune 2 (Disabling hyperthreading appears to fix it)
People at Dell involved (PLEASE report additional names. Let's help keep Dell honest!):
- Marc Owens (Support)
- Gerald Thomas (Engineering)
- Patrick Dubois (Engineering, claims only a 2% failure rate. Anecdotal evidence suggests the rate may be higher, however delltalk is not crowding with people reporting GPU Failures. You always hear about people with a problem. You don't necessarily hear about people who don't have problems at all...)
POTENTIAL WORKAROUND!
I've found a potential workaround for this problem, I'm testing it now. It involves the use of Powerstrip (www.entechtaiwan.com). Implement/test this fix at your own risk!
UPDATE: After a furious bout with Battlefield 1942, I still experienced a lockup. Some people are reporting that even cranking down their Core/Mem timings as low as Powerstrip will let them, they are still experiencing lockups. downclocking 10mhz Core/Mem allows me to play indefinitely with a negligible performance hit (I don't even see one, though i'm sure a benchmark will reveal otherwise). For some, this workaround works 100%, but your mileage may vary. Bottom line, if your unit freezes on 3d games in general, regardless of title, you likely have a bad GPU board.
- Install Powerstrip (www.entechtaiwan.com)
- Right-click the Powerstrip icon in the systray and select "Performance Profiles" then "Configure"
- Drag your engine clock and memory clock controls to the LOWEST level possible in Powerstrip, then click APPLY and OK. Confirm the warning that you're changing your settings. NOTE: clicking the option to turn off floating point precision helps out here...
Now...... here's the important part: - Repeat steps one and two above
- Slide the engine clock back to the default 9700 mobility engine/memory timings (445/263).
- Retest your games. See if you lock up. if you do, lower these values by 2mhz each until the lockups stop.
- There's evidence that suggests you have to do this entire procedure after a reboot. Merely loading Pstrip at windows startup may not be enough.
ITEMS OF NOTE WITH THIS WORKAROUND:
- When changing settings, you can't get back to the original default values exactly... Closest I can come in Powerstrip is 444/264 even with floating point precision turned on. This hasn't affected my testing, but heck - it COULD be part of the problem... Maybe there's a default scale of valid core/memory rates, and perhaps it's configured wrong by default at the factory?
- After a reboot and reload of powerstrip, values switched to 446/263 (weird)
- Fix appears to be dependent on Powerstrip. If you don't load it at startup, the corruption & lockups come back
WHAT YOU SHOULD DO IF YOU HAVE AN INSPIRON XPS THAT LOCKS UP IN 3D APPLICATIONS:
- Call Dell Support (numbers below)
- If you are routed through Dell India, politely request that you be put into the Inspiron XPS queue, as you are one of the victims of the 3d freezing problem. If they don't know what you're talking about, ask for their email address and send them this URL.
- Once you talk to someone in the Inspiron XPS queue, you will get a much better level of service (These guys are typically more on-the-ball than Dell India). Request that you get a GPU replacement or complete notebook replacement if you feel better about that.
- I requested a replacement GPU. Without any complaining, they issued a DPS number right away and said they were overnighting a new video board to a field service tech in my area.
- If you don't have at-home service, you may be stuck sending your unit back to Dell.
- It's not recommended that you use CompleteCare, as i'm not sure if you get more than 1 replacement out of it. I didn't read the fineprint. Anyone know for sure how many incidents you can use CompleteCare for?
Support numbers for Dell Tech support:
- General Number: 1-800-624-9896
- Employee Purchase Program: 1-800-274-1410
- Student, Faculty & Staff Purchase Program: 1-800-274-1410
- Note that there IS specialized XPS support that appears to be handled out of their Idaho call center. However, you are still routed through Level 1 tech support in India. The best thing to do is say "I am aware the Inspiron XPS has a special queue for support, please direct my call there, please." - That worked for me.
The only working system, is the only one going back so far. I think if my issue was the one you guys are having, I would have stuck it out because there is power in numbers. I would expect you will see quick results.
