Graphics Artifacts with 8790 : Pink Colored Crap - Page 2

Ted @ Sager asked me to update my BIOS and see if the problem persisted. I didn't see why the updated BIOS would change anything. I figured if the BIOS was the problem, wouldn't it have been doing this out of the gate and not 5 months down the line? Anyway, I updated the BIOS yesterday. Threw AoM at it afterwards and was granted a terrible wish of continued artifacting. KOTOR confirmed it. No change. F10 let me turn the fans on High, but other than that, no change in the problem. I'm thinking it's along the lines of what GS was experiencing. Apparently mine just took a little while to settle in.

Disappointed. I'd rather not send my unit to the States. Major loss of time and money, even if it is covered under warranty. Hopefully the Export Option works out and I don't have to get grumpy over this.

FT, I used ATITool and turned the clock speed down to 390/270 and things seem more stable. See if that works out for you. Ganbatte

Brett

that's not a gamers' solution! hehe

i have just extensive texture crruption and they just gave me new drivers for my 7500, i have an 8880 model sager

Thank you so much for this post.

I recieved my 8790 a month ago and it had a weird artifacting problem.

When you start the notebook from a cold boot, and then started playing running any 3D application or game (I just used 3D Mark 2003 as a test), it would artifact terribly. Then if you leave it for a while, to "warm up" and then restart, and then try again, the artifacts would disappear. I could game properly.

I wasn't complete satisfied that I had to let me notebook warm up before I could game.

Then I found this thread, and then I loosened the screws under the keyboard.....and WHAM!!!!

No more artifacts!!! YAYAYAYAYAYAAAAA!!!

I'm really happy that this solution fixed my problem. PERFECT!!!

Thank you,
:L:

Artifact Fix #2

Hello all, I also own a Sager NP8790 Notebook PC with the ATI Radeon 9700 Mobility chip (256MB) and I've been also experiencing problems with artifacts. I understand that this thread is over a year old, but I'll bet there are others out there that still have this problem so here goes my solution.

First of all, I tried the solution recommended here with either loosening or rmoving the seven screws that were described. That did not work for me. However, I continued to remove the entire plate (after removing the keyboard) and I discovered something odd. I noticed that there was only one chip (unknown function and located bottom left) that only had a thermal compound pad installed out of the three that were visible. The other two were the ATI video and the Pentium CPU chips.

The ATI and CPU chips had no thermal compound element that would effectively transfer excess heat to the plate so I cut out two small pieces of thermal compound pads I had salvaged from an old notebook CPU (thermal paste may work also, but I have not verified this) and I placed them over the chips. I then reinstalled the plate (using ALL of the screws) and the keyboard and then proceeded to use the ATITool app recommended by brettgo1
(thanks brettgo1!) and underclocked both the core and memory freqs minus 100 the original value. This worked for me and I have not seen any artifacts since.

I think the problem is generally a heat-related problem involving the ATI 9700 Mobility Video chip as it could have been resolved by simply using a heat transfer or dissipation solution using the heat compound pads. In fact, I think it may just have been an assembly oversight by the notebook manufacturer as you usually want to provide some thermal compound solution for these types of chips. It's definitely used on other notebooks that I have seen or owned. Underclocking the video chip may not have been necessary, but I did not want to take a chance and did it anyway. I've noticed a neglible hit in performance, but the 3D hardcore gamer may think otherwise. I hope this helps those that still have this problem.

Ok, the artifacts came back after a day of testing. It was just as bad as before so what I did was to further underclock the chip's Core and Memory frequencies. Now, my Core frequency is 150 and the Memory frequency was set to 125. The artifacts dissappeared immediately after I did this which indicates that the problem is indeed the ATI Mobile Radeon 9700 video chip and not a driver issue. It kind of sucks that you have to underclock this chip substantially just to get it to work in a stable manner but hey, at least it is usable now. If I don't post an update within the next couple of days or so, then that means that my problem was fixed.

I did something like you indicated only I used new materials and cleaned everything (I'm a smoker) up. I used 7 pieces of thermal tape and did not replace the tick piece that covers the components under - roughly the (op) keys. So far every thing is great. I set using ATI-Tools it to 432/236.25 (Edit I had a typo - it should not have been 326.25 - That will be way overboard) and that worked wonders. While testing, I found that "illogical" settings would cause artifacts even if the speeds were very low.

to G for doing Clevo & Sager's work for them. Good to know someone is figuring out how to fix these things.

You guys should check this as well:
http://www.notebookforums.com/showpo...1&postcount=10

with the whole thread here:
http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?t=116149

It is a little bit of work (and void warranties, I guess) but it helps.

werds

The Gpu/Mem clock fix that G-Omaha is referring to was found by Inconel and I, we are still working on this issue trying to find a more stable, and more gamer friendly setting. Inconel was absolutely right about a higher core setting to reduce artifacts. G-Omaha,which I am sure ran his own tests, got the overclocking gpu idea from our tests, and it would be nice to give credit where it is due, I have been running these tests for the better part of the month, along with Inconels advice we are making progress. Our goal is to get a higher core (around 472.50) with a compatible mem setting, 236.25 is too low for that high of a core setting. Althugh I too am running games at 432/236.25 at the moment with no artifacts, we are trying to find the best balance between performance and stability.

We are still testing different memory timings and running tests. I will post our final results and possibly have a video bios release.

I am going to try loosening these screws and I will post if this allows higher settings.

-SLuG

How did you get the aluminum plate off? I removed all screws and tried lifting it off, but it was still attached to something, maybe the copper heatsink? Was wondering if you could enlighten me, maybe post a pic. I would love to get in there and lather on some arctic silver, plus clean it out.

-SLuG

I give you guys all of the credit. I just read your "works" and then applied some small modifications and cleaned off the tar on all contact surfaces and anything that could possibly radiate heat. Additionally that area under the (op) keys needs to be addressed - It was the "gunkiest" area and the one that was most prone to bad contact and the effects of heat. There is one chip that is covered by the shiny metail foil on the left had side of the unit (left to the chip that actually has heat trasfer tape). Insure that heat transfer tape is applied between that chip and the foil and then again on top of the foil to the metal plate to improve heat dissipation for that chip. End result is a cool left palm rest.

The thermal tape will need to be reapplied each time that the metal plate is removed for unit cleaning - IMHO.

All in all - good work guys and keep it up.

You must carefuly pull upward and make sure that the plate does not shift wo that the lower part (by touchpad) does not slip under the case. There is a part of the Heat Sink that is part of the plate.

If you are talkng about the foil to the left, I ust gently lifted it up and put the tape under it. Real pain to do and not "bunch up" the tape.

IMHO AS5 would NOT be the way to go because it has a tendency to "stick" things together and might be the cause of future damage should you wish to remove the plate in the future for cleaning.

Hello SLuG, I just removed all of the screws that were accessible (I forgot how many) and I easily pried it off. There wasn't any considerable resistance in its removal, to tell you the truth. The copper heatsink was the only component that actually contributed some resistance, but again, the plate was very easy to remove just using my fingers and very light force. I'd take it apart again, but I'm afraid I'd might screw something up as removing and reinstalling the keyboard tape-like ribbon cable is a pain in the butt. I've actually removed and reinstalled these type of ribbon cables in other types of electronic equipment (I'm an electronic technician) and you can easily screw them up. In addition, the sliding lock that actually holds the ribbon in place breaks very easily if you're not very careful. I've rendered a DVD recorder useless once because of this. I don't recommend messing with these connections unless you really need to.

On a different note, do you have a link to the analysis and tests that you and Iconel performed regarding overclocking in order to reduce the artifacts? I commend you guys on your efforts and I truly find it interesting in that going higher actually helps reduce or eliminate these artifacts, especially where you mention that "illogical settings" caused problems.

I did not remove the keyboard cable and simply "flipped" the plate and keyboard to the front of the laptop. Agree that those connectors break easily and that was why I did not disconnect it.

Thanks guys, I am going to order some thermal tape and try to get in there again.

I did remove all the screws and tried to lightly pull the plate upwards, but I did get some resistance, maybe it is some thermal tape that has binded to the plate. I will try again soon, and if I have time will take some pics.

Just to clear it up...

The copper heatsink that I can see under the aluminum plate is attached to the plate and will come off with it, or will the aluminum plate detach from the copper heatsink?

As for the clocking issue, 432/236.25 is the safest speed I have found so far, although I do get a few artifacts after an hour or so of Raven Shield on High graphics..which is a huge improvement from not being able to run any 3d apps. Inconel has layed out some memory timings and such for further tests, I will be running those as soon as I can and will post some updates. Perhaps I will start a new thread and see if some of you guys can run some tests with me, just to make sure that my 8790 is not defective therefore making these tests pointless.

I am at the point now, where I dont know if I want to get this thing fixed or just deal with it while I save money for a new lappy, rest assured I will finish testing though, if only to save some other 8790 owners the same frustrations I (we) have had to deal with. The goal is to find a safe, and performing video settings (Core/mem speeds, mem timings etc.) that users can apply out of the box in order to avoid this arttifacting problem all together.

http://www.notebookforums.com/showth...=56210&page=12

This is where Inconel and I hooked up and began running tests...You might want to browse around in this very long thread. Inconel and I are talking via. Private Message these days...I will start a thread once I start testing again, with a recap and some test parameters so others can run these tests to make sure that the results are universal.

-SLuG

Hello SLuG, first of all, thanks for the link. The copper heatsink is part of the aluminum plate. When I pulled mine off the only chip that had a thermal pad on it was the chip that I mentioned before that I could not identify, but now I strongly suspect was the motherboard's chipset (it makes sense). The other two were the ATI video and CPU chips. You should not have any problems prying the aluminum plate off.

As to the clocking issues regarding the ATI Mobile Radeon 9700 is concerned, I finally settled to setting my Core frequency to 150 and the Memory frequency to 125. Artifacts were really bad just moments prior to making this change (blocks all over the screen) and once I made this change, they immediately disappeared. I settled for using the Omega v2.6.75a driver and used its overclocking utility to make this clock change. I did not use ATITool.

Also, I've found Sach's Marine Aquarium 3D Screensaver to be a good benchmarking app in testing for artifacts. You can just let it do it's thing and go off and do something else. I believe it uses OpenGL for its 3D features, but I'm not really sure about that; however, I do think it is a great app to use for testing your overclocking/underclocking settings. I've let this screensaver run for about 4 hours straight using my last settings and no (0%) artifacts were displayed. When I had problems, artifacts usually showed up withing 10-15 minutes. Don't use Omega's artifact discovery tool as it does not work (at least it did not for me). Using a more 3D graphics intensive app, like this screensaver, is much better.

Why don't you try underclocking your Radeon 9700 like I did to see if you can achieve 0% artifacts? To me, it just does not make any sense to set your core and memory frequencies any higher because of heating issues. Unless you're a hardcore gamer, this may not be too practical for you. I just play 3D games occasionally, but I do use some other 3D rendering apps from time to time so I really do want the best quality and stability that can possibly be achieved along with being able to reliably play a 3D graphics-intensive game from time to time. The Mobile Radeon 9700 is definitely a bad video chip design, but I think your Sager NP8790 can be made to be more tolerable and/or more useful and you'll definitely be able to prolong the life of your video chip by underclocking it.

If you were to read through the forums concerning the d870 (sager 8790). You would understand why underclocking is not a solution, many people have tried this only to find that their artifact free system is temporary, artifacts returned full fledged after a limited amount of time. This is part of the problem and why I am so thankful to Inconel for dropping some of his wealth of vga knowledge on us. The solution that we have been working on, is for a permanent fix, overclocking the core, and underclocking the mem has revealed the only promising results as of yet, we are still working on tweaking the mem timings.

Simply slowing down the core/mem speeds is not a solution, the goal is to find speeds that the vga chip and memory "likes" not simply to keep slowing it down...and waiting for the artifacting to return. Core and mem work in tandem, so you need to find a setting that optimizes their relationship to one another, a low core setting could sabotage the mem, and cause more errors...and vice versa.

Also. a screensaver is not the best way to benchmark especially when I am trying to find settings for people who want to play intensive games.

Install aTiTools v. 0.24 to run benchmark and artifact tests, it is a very handy graphic testing program, many features ... ability to run "Find Max" tests, and scan for artifacts for extended periods of time.

-Slug