NotebookForums.com › Forums › General Notebook Discussions › Linux & Other OS's › Everything just works with Windows, when will linux catch up?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Everything just works with Windows, when will linux catch up? - Page 2

post #21 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by drlouis View Post
it could be true. I might, in fact be an incompetent windows user. But I've installed Windows from scratch dozens of times, and I've got at least 90% of my total computer time on Windows. But I'm not all that surprised I guess, most windows users have probably never installed it from scratch.

You might have a point there Doc. Installing from scratch can at times be good, but most often, there are 'bumps' along the way...

On a side note, I think that I have found a distro that I will stay with for a little while: PCLinuxOS 2007. It seems to be a bit better than Red Hat Enterprise 5.0...
post #22 of 52
I have just installed XP and Ubuntu 7.04 on an Inspiron 8200. I still need to download drivers to complete the XP install but the Ubuntu is complete including the internal wireless.
post #23 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by drlouis View Post
it could be true. I might, in fact be an incompetent windows user. But I've installed Windows from scratch dozens of times, and I've got at least 90% of my total computer time on Windows. But I'm not all that surprised I guess, most windows users have probably never installed it from scratch.

Yea those friends refuse to install windows fresh. They often call upon me to do it lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mb67
On a side note, I think that I have found a distro that I will stay with for a little while: PCLinuxOS 2007. It seems to be a bit better than Red Hat Enterprise 5.0...

I'm not too fond of PCLOS. Its great for people new to linux, but way too easy in my opinion.
post #24 of 52
while I agree that Linux has a lot of pros (heck, I'm posting from Ubuntu right now), Windows XP specifically still has the advantage of universality- there is an XP program for nearly everything, even if you have to look for it. And while a lot of programs are quite easy to install in Linux, via repositories and the like, there are also several others that seem next to impossible in comparison to installing a similar function program in XP. In Windows, I've never had to recompile the kernel or wait an hour for a program to compile itself so it works with my system. I've had to do this multiple times in Linux. Also, if a Windows program doesn't work, there are a plethora of others that do the exact same function, so it's highly likely that a compatible program exists, even with specialized functions. Linux programs are much more often one of a kind, so if they aren't compatible, you're stuck.

So while making Linux usable is easier than Windows, making Windows fully featured is easier than Linux.
post #25 of 52
Don't think I agree in MANY cases DJembe, mind giving some examples?

For most circumstances, for instance Office, Audio, Graphics, etc, I can think of multiple programs easily, and many of them should be in repositories for most distros anyways, so you shouldn't be waiting for things to compile(Unless you are like me and like customization that much you run Gentoo

There is limited, but still a selection for tasks like Video Editing, CD Burning, and even Games. I am curious what type of apps you are referring to?

Seablade
post #26 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by seablade View Post
Don't think I agree in MANY cases DJembe, mind giving some examples?

For most circumstances, for instance Office, Audio, Graphics, etc, I can think of multiple programs easily, and many of them should be in repositories for most distros anyways, so you shouldn't be waiting for things to compile(Unless you are like me and like customization that much you run Gentoo

There is limited, but still a selection for tasks like Video Editing, CD Burning, and even Games. I am curious what type of apps you are referring to?

Seablade
hardware sensor monitoring, undervolting, and suspend are the areas I'm currently having problems with
post #27 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djembe View Post
hardware sensor monitoring, undervolting, and suspend are the areas I'm currently having problems with
as far as i am aware installing suspend2 kernel patches + hibernate-script is the best way to go for suspend. @ seablade: you sure cd burning should be on that list? k3b, gnomebaker, brasero, serpentine (audio only), nautilus cd/dvd creator, xfburn (now that most of those are just front ends of cdrecord is another story) ... to be honest thats almost as many programs as i am aware about for windows (XP Burner Pro, Nero, A120%, Infrarecorder, Windows integrated burner, WMP (audio only))
post #28 of 52
Quote:
@ seablade: you sure cd burning should be on that list? k3b, gnomebaker, brasero, serpentine (audio only), nautilus cd/dvd creator, xfburn (now that most of those are just front ends of cdrecord is another story) ... to be honest thats almost as many programs as i am aware about for windows (XP Burner Pro, Nero, A120%, Infrarecorder, Windows integrated burner, WMP (audio only))
Nope I am not sure Actually I have used a few of those, some of them I was not aware of, like xfburn. Eh well I am wrong on one point but it helps to prove the primary point of my post Seablade
post #29 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djembe View Post
hardware sensor monitoring, undervolting, and suspend are the areas I'm currently having problems with

And unfortunately the vast majority of that is not software issues, but rather lack of hardware support, specifically ACPI implementations that do not follow the spec. That is why you have to have drivers often for those same things under windows.

Seablade
post #30 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by seablade View Post
And unfortunately the vast majority of that is not software issues, but rather lack of hardware support, specifically ACPI implementations that do not follow the spec. That is why you have to have drivers often for those same things under windows.

Seablade

yup, that's what I was referring to. perhaps a better way to put it is that Windows' universality means that more companies will invariably make Windows software that supports their hardware, whereas they aren't as likely to make drivers for Linux. Hopefully, though, that is changing and more and more companies will make Linux drivers and software for their products.
post #31 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djembe View Post
yup, that's what I was referring to. perhaps a better way to put it is that Windows' universality means that more companies will invariably make Windows software that supports their hardware, whereas they aren't as likely to make drivers for Linux. Hopefully, though, that is changing and more and more companies will make Linux drivers and software for their products.

Now therein I agree with you.

I am also hoping the amount of crud you have to go through for drivers on Vista make people(Hardware folks and consumers) take a second look around.

Seablade
post #32 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwilightVampire View Post
Oh its all quite true I showed this to a few friends of mine and they thought doc was an incompetent windows user trying to just plain flame Windows and praise linux fake propaganda style. They had no idea really installing Windows was an annoying/long thing.
Here have been my experiences with working with the various OSes: Installing XP from a "full" installer CD: 1. Boot computer from CD. 2. Run the partitioner, select partition to install on (assumes that the XP install CD has LBA48 patches, your HDD is 120 GB or less, and that you have all SATA/RAID drivers handy.) 3. Format install partition. 4. Copy installation files to the formatted partition. 5. Reboot computer. 6. Wait for computer to install base OS files. 7. Input locale, username, network settings, etc. 8. Reboot computer. 9. while(needed_drivers > 0) { Download and install a missing driver; Reboot computer; needed_drivers = needed_drivers - 1; } 10. Find the CDs and registration keys for or download any applications you want to install. Reboot after installation if needed. 11. Create a limited user account. 12. Log into limited user account, change theme to Windows Classic (because the Luna theme sucks.) 13. Restore user data from an external HDD. 14. Finished. Elapsed time: It generally takes me 60 minutes to get the partitioning, formatting, and copying of OS files done and to the first reboot, then about 20-40 minutes to get the base OS set up. Driver and application installation varies widely. My desktop was easy as it pretty much had only NVIDIA ICs in it and needed just one driver disk, but laptops are often much thornier and take a lot longer, including several drivers put on a USB thumb drive so that the laptop can get online and download the rest it needs. Installing programs also varies a bunch, and installing proprietary programs is always a much bigger pain than open-source ones as the OSS stuff can be simply downloaded instead of having to find install CDs, keys, mucking with activation, etc. for proprietary applications. Patching also takes a varying amount of time, depending on what SP/patch level the install disk was. The quickest I've installed XP from a full install disk is about four hours, the longest is the better part of two days, but generally it's more like 6-8 hours. Installing XP from a restore image 1. Boot computer into recovery partition. 2. Select recovery type, hit "Enter." 3. Watch the computer copy files and restart itself 10-15 times. 4. Enter your name, locale, etc. 5. Uninstall the crapware that's present on the recovery image. Reboot if needed. 6. Install an antivirus and run updates. 7. Install your programs. 8. Create a limited user account. 9. Log into the limited user account and change the theme to Windows Classic as the Luna theme is ugly. 10. Restore user data from an external HDD or network. 11. Finished. Elapsed time: Generally 30 minutes to an hour to perform the reimage, then the time will vary considerably depending on how new the recovery image is (number of patches/updates you need to get), the amount of crapware installed, and what programs you need to reinstall. Generally a reimage will take two to three hours as long as there is a decent broadband connection to get updates and the user doesn't need to restore 500 GB of data from an external drive. Installing a binary Linux distribution 1. Boot the computer from the installer CD. 2. Either select "Install to disk" from the boot menu or from an icon on the desktop, dependent if you have a standard or Live CD-based install disk. 3. Specify your desired disk partition setup in the partitioner. 4. Fine-tune what programs you want installed in the system setup if you want to change the defaults. 5. Watch while the installer copies the OS to the hard drive and installs/sets up itself and its programs. 6. Input a root password. 7. Input your (limited) user account information and locale, language, etc. 8. Reboot the computer. 9. Run the package manager's update tool. Reboot if there is a kernel update. 10. Finished. Elapsed time: 20 to about 90 minutes, depending on the speed of the computer and the number of programs installed. Generally it will be 30-45 minutes on most newer computers. Restoration of user data is only necessary if this is a new install or the HDD died as all Linux distributions I know of put the user files on a partition separate from the OS, allowing a reinstall to not kill the user's data. Installing a source-based Linux distribution 1. Boot from the install disk. 2. Run the disk partitioner and set up the partitions. 3. Format and mount the partitions. 4. Download the source tarballs to the root partition on the HDD. 5. Set the base system compile/configuration options. 6. Chroot to the root partition on the HDD. 7. Compile the kernel and enough of the base system to boot from. 8. Reboot the computer. 9. Set up your user account. 10. Compile and configure X11. 11. Compile and configure a desktop environment like GNOME or KDE. 12. Compile any other applications you need. 13. Finished. Elapsed time: It generally takes an hour to configure and compile the kernel and base system on a decent system. The rest of the compilation and set-up very much depends on the throughput of the computer. My Athlon 64 X2 4200+ desktop generally takes about 20 hours to compile the entire base system, kernel, desktop environment, and programs I need. My old 2.2 GHz P4 laptop took several days as the P4 is bad at compiling and it's a single-core versus a dual-core CPU.
post #33 of 52
I sit about the same as you for XP install, depending on my internet connection speed for the updates.

Kubuntu is partitioned up and running in 2 hours.
post #34 of 52
same boat, i can easily quote a good 4 or 5 hours for a XP setup... ubuntu takes about 90 min to 2 hrs or so. PCLOS takes about an hour....
post #35 of 52
SuSE Enterprise Linux takes about 40-45 minutes to install, if I'm watching it properly. However, it's usually around an hour as I have to do something else while it's installing.
post #36 of 52
Well I have had it with XP and windows in general. I am going Open source only. Gnome or KDE guys?
post #37 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarqHelmet View Post
Well I have had it with XP and windows in general. I am going Open source only. Gnome or KDE guys?

I have tried both, and am currently using Gnome. Each one has it's own characteristics, and I like both.
post #38 of 52
e17.

Seablade
post #39 of 52
Not following you Seablade.
post #40 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarqHelmet View Post
Not following you Seablade.

Linky
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Linux & Other OS's
NotebookForums.com › Forums › General Notebook Discussions › Linux & Other OS's › Everything just works with Windows, when will linux catch up?