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abf found a likable Suse

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
With all the hype about Ubuntu .... or rather Kubuntu w/ KDE4 coming soon, Suse was the distro that got away. At one time it was on top, and then when Novell signed its soul away to Redmond Suse became the bastard child of the linux underworld.

This is not the first time I've posted here about Suse. In fact, many of you may remember that I have previously bashed this distro to hell . I've tried every major release since 9.1 (including 9.3, 10.0, 10.1 and 10.2) and every single one of them never failed to disappoint. The 9.x series had messed up issues with my sound and graphics (why was intel 8x0 freaken ac97 sound so hard to configure? isn't it the generic of the most generic?). 10.0 Had the same issues as 9.x but also had ungodly long boot time (if you thought Ubuntu was slow to boot...double that and then some). 10.1 and 10.2 fixed the sound/graphics issues but introduced Zen which as you may know was broken beyond all hell making package management a nightmare. Long boot time was still an issue. Finally we got 10.3.... sound works, boot time is reasonable, package manager not broken. Can this be? An actual usable Suse?

Why I installed Suse 10.3 Gnome (CD version):
Got frustrated w/ not being able to get Counter Strike running under wine, and I lost my XP disk, so I installed Vista. Had Vista for about a week while i got my CSS fix. That was a brutal and painful experience. After I decided to kill vista I checked Distrowatch and saw PCLOS 2008 MiniMe was out...and decided to send it for a spin. Came out somewhat disappointed (waiting for the Full edition of PCLOS 2008..hopefully w/ KDE4), so decided to try out Fedora 8. Fedora to its true nature was a whole bunch of fail. Then i didn't feel like waiting for a huge iso to d/l so i went through the stack of recently burned distros I have...suse 10.3 happened to be one that caught my attention so I figured why the hell not.

Anyway... what can I say. So far (granted its only been a few hours) I am fairly satisfied. Hardware recognition out of the box was good for the most part. Needed to manually adjust the resolution from 1024x768 to 1280x800 though. Then there was no recognition of my wireless (madwifi)...otherwise it was good. So i hooked up my lan (sis900 which worked), added some repos to my repo list (including the madwifi repo) and installed the madwifi package (which for some reason pulled in fglrx as a dependency..doesn't matter since i was gonna get fglrx anyway). Since a kernel update was needed as well... a reboot later my wireless was working (as well as my video) and I was in order. I must say I am fairly pleased w/ Suse's new package manager. I wouldn't say its better than my personal favorite pacman (on arch linux), or even APT (my 2nd best pick) but unlike zen it actually works very well and fairly quick (faster than YUM or URPMI). Then I went back to the community repos and installed flash, java, media codecs, browser plugins, etc... again fairly quick and painless procedure. Not as straight forward as say Automatix...but easier than on some other distros i've seen.

As always, the default theme looks really good. You got your green wallpaper and the lizard logo. Clean lines, no gaudy anything, good icon theme. One concern is the use of SLAB... although it looks kinda cool, I find it much less practical than the default Gnome menus. I always find myself in the More Applications menu looking for other things...who knows, maybe once my frequently used apps make it on the Favorite Apps menu and I will no longer have the need to keep going into different settings/utils/configs I won't be hitting the "More Applications" button quite as much.

Speed is important to me. Speed is my #1 concern about Ubuntu...and thus my not using it. Suse has also generally been on the slow side (side note: Fedora 8 is really slow) but this release is not too bad. Not quite as snappy as PCLOS2007 but quick enough where I don't sit around twiddling my thumbs waiting for Firefox to open.

I am not gonna say... go try Suse 10.3 b/c its the greatest thing since sliced bread, but I will tell you that its not bad. So basically if you are bored, looking for something new, or just wanna kill some time till Ubuntu 8.04 is out...give this distro a spin.
post #2 of 18
hmm maybe I should give it a try, Ill start downloading it tonight when I get home from the airport.
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
update: got the game Nexiuz to run on Suse w/o any lag (sound or video). Not much of an achievement perhaps but when I tried it previously on Ubuntu 7.10, PCLOS 2007 (and 2008), Fedora 8, and Windows Vista... all had issues running it, primarily crappy video lag giving me like 5 FPS. This is great b/c its my 2nd favorite native linux game after WolfET
post #4 of 18
lol nice abf... but i always wonder where you get the time to try all of these distros?

good luck with your suse experience... knowing you it'll be off of your hard drive within a month.
post #5 of 18
no offense intended abf, but I get a chuckle out of all the time you spend in search of speed. presumably to save ....time.
post #6 of 18
downloading the DVD iso as we speak, if I get stuck, abf is here to help
post #7 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by drlouis View Post
no offense intended abf, but I get a chuckle out of all the time you spend in search of speed. presumably to save ....time.
IRONY ALERT
post #8 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGEE1212 View Post
IRONY ALERT
MASTER OF THE OBVIOUS ALERT
post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
NOTE: I used the 700mb iso for the GNOME ONLY version of 10.3. I did not use the FULL DVD version so don't hold me accountable for any differences.

Right now I am on break (start school again monday) and really bored, besides work (20 hrs or so a week) I have nothing better to do...so I try all these various distros.

Its not that I am in search of speed , its just that faster is better and slow things (ubuntu...suse 10.0) piss me off. I dont wanna wait forever for stuff to happen after I click it. It of course just so happens that PCLOS2007 is fast and easy to use, and ARCH is very flexible and fast.

I dont think SUSE will be off my drive any time soon. I'd like to keep it till @ least spring break (end of march) if not all the way to end of the semester (mid may) since several classes I am talking require I save my work and go back to it throughout. Would sure suck to lose a paper I did in early march that wasn't due till early may just because I formated. Besides, everything works pretty damn well right now. Its not too slow (not super fast...but not slow), the games that I play run well (Nexuiz and ET...all other games I play on my 360), and its pretty damn stable.
post #10 of 18
Thread Starter 
FOUND THE BEEF

It is well known that Fedora is the lead developer for AIGLX, and seeing technology's superiority many other distros have favored AIGLX whenever possible. SUSE on the other hand is the leader of the XGL camp. That said, to run compiz-fusion you'd need one or the other. My personal choice is with AIGLX but since this is SUSE it is forcing me to use XGL. Some hacking around later I did manage AIGLX to run but it was fairly unstable and compiz itself failed to launch for various reasons. After giving up on that idea I figured whatever, lets try XGL... that froze my Xorg. Everything would show fine but the keyboard wouldn't type and the mouse wouldn't click (but it would move). Was quite horrible and made the computer useless. After disabling XGL in text mode Xorg was usable again. Of course, no compiz. For the record I have an ATI 9700 running the latest FGLRX (which does support AIGLX unlike the previous versions). I don't really care for compiz since it just makes the system run louder and slower, and gets in the way of games... but for those of you who do care you should know.
post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by abf View Post
NOTE: I used the 700mb iso for the GNOME ONLY version of 10.3. I did not use the FULL DVD
Wish you have told me before I downloaded 4 gigs LoL, well now that I have it, lets try it and see what happens.
post #12 of 18
Thread Starter 
kinda interested as to how the DVD version is compared to the CD. I mean, for starters it comes with KDE and Gnome (and maybe Fluxbox?)... which basically means you have 2 sets of packages for every task (ex. Amorok and Banshee or Pidgin and Kopete). On the down side it is KDE 3.8 (note: KDE4 is out today source: http://www.kde.org/announcements/4.0/ ) but if you are daring you can upgrade your sources to Factory and thus install KDE4. Seems kinda pointless anyway.

I am a gnome user. Most of that comes from me liking some gnome apps more than the qt counterparts (ok...so K3b is the best thing since sliced bread, but Brasero isn't that bad). Even then, one of my favorite distros, PCLOS is KDE only so i can live with KDE, but when it is KDE only. Not kde + gnome + fluxbox + e17 + icewm (doesn't Sabayon come w/ all of these?). Well...anyway. Good luck. Any livecds out yet featuring KDE4? I really wanna test it out but I don't wanna install it (give up my so far pretty good gnome-only suse config). Hmm...have a Thinkpad running PCLOS2007beta3...wonder if I can update it to run this stuff
post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by abf View Post
FOUND THE BEEF
<snip technical stuff>
Everything would show fine but the keyboard wouldn't type and the mouse wouldn't click (but it would move). Was quite horrible and made the computer useless.
<snip more technical stuff>
I had the same issue on Ubuntu with Beryl. (noted it in my 'review') It was random, sometimes it'd work for a day or two, then it'd lock up 4 or 6 times in a single session. It was downright maddening til I figured out what the cause was. I didn't really care about Beryl, so it wasn't a big loss, but it was cool to show the eye candy to those guys who tend to say; "well sure linux is secure, and free is always good, but it's just so far behind windows...." eye candy is one of those things you can just say: "you think so? ... here check this out, does your windows do that?"
post #14 of 18
Thread Starter 
webcam issues?

i have a logitech quickcam for notebooks (usb) and I had it working under PCLOS. It was pretty dark and murky but at least it worked. Under suse I cant get it for the life of me. I basically installed every webcam driver known to man and followed a few howtos (including Gentoo Wiki and something i found on the Suse forums). No luck.

lsusb:
Code:
Bus 003 Device 004: ID 0ecd:a100 Lite-On IT Corp. 
Bus 003 Device 003: ID 05e3:0605 Genesys Logic, Inc. USB 2.0 Hub [ednet]
Bus 003 Device 001: ID 0000:0000  
Bus 002 Device 002: ID 0425:0101 Motorola Semiconductors HK, Ltd G-Tech Wireless Mouse & Keyboard
Bus 002 Device 001: ID 0000:0000  
Bus 001 Device 005: ID 046d:08dd Logitech, Inc. 
Bus 001 Device 001: ID 0000:0000  

lsmod:
Code:
spca5xx               657640  0 
pwc                    84708  0 
compat_ioctl32          5376  1 pwc
quickcam               72100  0 
videodev               30464  3 spca5xx,pwc,quickcam
v4l2_common            20608  1 videodev
v4l1_compat            16388  1 videodev
uhci_hcd               27024  0 
snd_usb_audio          82176  0 
snd_usb_lib            19712  1 snd_usb_audio
snd_rawmidi            28416  1 snd_usb_lib
snd_hwdep              13316  1 snd_usb_audio
iptable_filter          6912  0 
ip_tables              16324  1 iptable_filter
ip6table_filter         6784  0 
ip6_tables             17476  1 ip6table_filter
x_tables               18308  2 ip_tables,ip6_tables
af_packet              29064  4 
ipv6                  268280  14 
snd_pcm_oss            50432  0 
snd_mixer_oss          20096  1 snd_pcm_oss
snd_seq                54452  0 
snd_seq_device         12172  2 snd_rawmidi,snd_seq
cpufreq_conservative    11272  0 
cpufreq_userspace       8704  0 
cpufreq_powersave       5888  0 
powernow_k8            18564  0 
apparmor               40736  0 
loop                   21636  0 
dm_mod                 56880  0 
pcmcia                 41076  0 
firmware_class         13568  1 pcmcia
irda                  120712  0 
parport_pc             40764  0 
parport                37832  1 parport_pc
rtc_cmos               12064  0 
rtc_core               23048  1 rtc_cmos
crc_ccitt               6144  1 irda
rtc_lib                 7040  1 rtc_core
wlan_scan_sta          16256  1 
ath_rate_sample        16000  1 
fglrx                1502508  9 
usb_storage            80780  0 
battery                14724  0 
ac                      9604  0 
serio_raw              10756  0 
k8temp                  9600  0 
hwmon                   7300  1 k8temp
ide_core              122948  1 usb_storage
button                 12560  0 
ath_pci                92704  0 
wlan                  187424  4 wlan_scan_sta,ath_rate_sample,ath_pci
snd_intel8x0m          21132  0 
sis900                 26112  0 
mii                     9344  1 sis900
yenta_socket           28684  2 
i2c_sis96x              9220  0 
i2c_core               27520  1 i2c_sis96x
usbhid                 41300  0 
snd_intel8x0           36636  1 
joydev                 13632  0 
snd_ac97_codec         97060  2 snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0
ac97_bus                6272  1 snd_ac97_codec
hid                    29184  1 usbhid
ath_hal               195536  3 ath_rate_sample,ath_pci
snd_pcm                82564  5 snd_usb_audio,snd_pcm_oss,snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0,snd_ac97_codec
snd_timer              26756  2 snd_seq,snd_pcm
rsrc_nonstatic         15872  1 yenta_socket
snd                    58164  15 snd_usb_audio,snd_usb_lib,snd_rawmidi,snd_hwdep,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_seq,snd_seq_device,snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0,snd_ac97_codec,snd_pcm,snd_timer
pcmcia_core            40852  3 pcmcia,yenta_socket,rsrc_nonstatic
ff_memless              9352  1 usbhid
ohci1394               36272  0 
ieee1394               91136  1 ohci1394
soundcore              11460  1 snd
snd_page_alloc         14472  3 snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0,snd_pcm
sr_mod                 19492  0 
cdrom                  37020  1 sr_mod
shpchp                 35092  0 
pci_hotplug            33216  1 shpchp
amd64_agp              16004  1 
agpgart                35764  2 fglrx,amd64_agp
sg                     37036  0 
ehci_hcd               34956  0 
sd_mod                 31104  4 
ohci_hcd               23684  0 
usbcore               123756  11 spca5xx,pwc,quickcam,uhci_hcd,snd_usb_audio,snd_usb_lib,usb_storage,usbhid,ehci_hcd,ohci_hcd
edd                    12996  0 
ext3                  131976  2 
mbcache                12292  1 ext3
jbd                    68148  1 ext3
fan                     9220  0 
pata_sis               17668  3 
libata                137032  1 pata_sis
scsi_mod              140376  5 usb_storage,sr_mod,sg,sd_mod,libata
thermal                20744  0 
processor              40876  2 powernow_k8,thermal

post #15 of 18
i wonder why suse always has problems... yet remains so popular...

every distro has been getting it right... we're seeing the shift to distros that work completely out of the box with many hardware configs... but i always read suse users having problems....



ps
KDE 4.0! gonna try it out.
post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
having to install video drivers (fglrx) and wireless drivers (madwifi) because they are not included by default is not a problem for me at all. neither should it be for most other (not totally n00b) users. yeah suse is not perfect out the box compared to say oh...PCLOS or hell even Sabayon which includes everything and the kitchen sink, but it it still better off than quite a few other distros out of the box (Vector, Zenwalk, Fedora). I think the appeal comes from the familiar name. Also, once the person installs it, despite some of the things not working (hell..how many things actually WORK on a clean windows install. wireless? no, video? no, correct resolution? no, any apps installed? no), the distro itself (artwork and such) is well polished, clean and professional. Also there is Yast which like it or not does take the need out of having to manually configure text files to get stuff tweaked. People like the "click click done" as opposed to entering the scary world of console.
post #17 of 18
I still think the biggest reason Suse is so popular is that it has a 'commercial' version aimed at enterprise. Thus a lot of IT types end up using it and getting comfortable with it at work. Those are the types most likely to both fiddle with it at home, and also most likely to be asked for input from a newb who wants to check out this linux thing. Doesn't have to be the best if it makes it enough hard drives for other reasons, and is good enough to garner a recommendation.
post #18 of 18
i got tired of having the antivirus, antispyware and other kinds of bullshit slowing down my computer with xp, so i changed to suse about 6 months ago - never been so happy with my computer since then.

a few optimizations for speed in suse 10.3:

1 - remove beagle, it eats up system resources like mad. if you need other search program try searchmonkey (you can only install it after adding packman repository - step 4)

2 - you can also remove apparmor. go to package manager and deselect it. if it gives you any warning, select "ignore forever" or something like that

3 - you can use the package manager in console mode by opening a terminal and typing - sudo /sbin/yast2 sw_single - much faster in my experience, good compromise between graphical and command line

4 - if you don't like compiling from source and want lots of software available, you can add more package repositories to the package manager, take a look here.
http://en.opensuse.org/Package_Repositories
http://en.opensuse.org/Add_Package_Repositories_to_YaST
http://en.opensuse.org/YaST_package_repository
it is a good idea to add at least the OSS, NON-OSS and packman repositories. for the first 2 disable automatic refresh (see the 2nd link above).

other optimizations and tweaking:
http://www.softwareinreview.com/linu...suse_10.3.html

also if you really want your system optimized for speed, forget gnome and install xfce - bear in mind you will spend a few hours to get it working right. i can provide more details for this if you are interested.
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