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Will 4 gb ram help?

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 
I know that this subject has been beaten to death all over the internet about how 32bit OS will only recognize 2-3 GB of ram depending on setup even if you physically have 4 gb ram in the machine.

I've heard all about stuff I don't understand like hardware takes some RAM or about mapping memory addresses but they all don't answer the question:

Should I upgrade to 4 gb? Will it help my performance or should I just upgrade to 3 gb?

Is it better that my hardware have an extra gig of ram to play with or is it a waste of money?
post #2 of 11
Might as well get 4 to make it true dual channel. But 3's ok if price is what matters.
post #3 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by draggono View Post
I know that this subject has been beaten to death all over the internet about how 32bit OS will only recognize 2-3 GB of ram depending on setup even if you physically have 4 gb ram in the machine.

I've heard all about stuff I don't understand like hardware takes some RAM or about mapping memory addresses but they all don't answer the question:

Should I upgrade to 4 gb? Will it help my performance or should I just upgrade to 3 gb?

Is it better that my hardware have an extra gig of ram to play with or is it a waste of money?
4GB is a waste of money with a 32-bit operating system
post #4 of 11
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wraithrsw View Post
Might as well get 4 to make it true dual channel. But 3's ok if price is what matters.
what does "true dual channel" mean?

Basically, all i want to know is: will the extra gig of ram be put to use? I don't care if windows will recognize it or not, I just care if it will help my performance
post #5 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by draggono View Post
what does "true dual channel" mean?

Basically, all i want to know is: will the extra gig of ram be put to use? I don't care if windows will recognize it or not, I just care if it will help my performance
It just means it's as close to dual channel as you can get. It might be a slight bump in performance but hardly noticeable for most tasks.
post #6 of 11
Whether you need new RAM or not is totally up to the particular user.

Note: You should only do the following after continual computer use. Try to do some average things you do on the computer as well as a few of the intensive tasks you do. You can multitask as well.

If you are under XP, then open task manager and go the performance tab. Look at the peak commit charge. If it is more than the total physical memory then yes you will get a performance increase. If these values are even reasonably close (say 200000 KB) then you could still upgrade. However, if your physical ram is much more than the commit charge then it is pretty much a waste.

Now I can explain all of this as well as hardware taking part of the address space need be. For now, just ignore the whole dual channel debate as dual channel is pretty much insignificant.
post #7 of 11
Thread Starter 
Well according to crucial's online analyzer, my T61 doesn't support dual channel anyways..

You guys have been a great help! but I have a couple more questions:

1. How do you find out your current RAM's clock speed? I have two sticks of 1gb in my laptop right now, and if i do upgrade, I'll prob just replace 1 stick with a 2gb stick. I just want to match the correct speed (I know it'll just run slower if I buy one that is faster, but I might as well match it up as best I can)

2. Does anyone have experience with creating a ramdisk? I've heard that you can use the extra gig (supposing if I go with 2 2gb sticks) to create a ram disk, then set windows to use the ram disk as the page file instead of using the hard drive. But if I have to create the ramdisk from within windows.. then wouldn't that not work since windows can't see the extra gig to begin with?

thanks so much guys
post #8 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by draggono View Post
Well according to crucial's online analyzer, my T61 doesn't support dual channel anyways..

You guys have been a great help! but I have a couple more questions:

1. How do you find out your current RAM's clock speed? I have two sticks of 1gb in my laptop right now, and if i do upgrade, I'll prob just replace 1 stick with a 2gb stick. I just want to match the correct speed (I know it'll just run slower if I buy one that is faster, but I might as well match it up as best I can)

2. Does anyone have experience with creating a ramdisk? I've heard that you can use the extra gig (supposing if I go with 2 2gb sticks) to create a ram disk, then set windows to use the ram disk as the page file instead of using the hard drive. But if I have to create the ramdisk from within windows.. then wouldn't that not work since windows can't see the extra gig to begin with?

thanks so much guys
Pretty much every notebook sold since 2006 has 667 Mhz DDR2 RAM, since that's the maximum the Intel and AMD chipsets could handle. So I'd bet yours is 667 Mhz.
post #9 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by draggono View Post
(...)

2. Does anyone have experience with creating a ramdisk? I've heard that you can use the extra gig (supposing if I go with 2 2gb sticks) to create a ram disk, then set windows to use the ram disk as the page file instead of using the hard drive. But if I have to create the ramdisk from within windows.. then wouldn't that not work since windows can't see the extra gig to begin with?

thanks so much guys
I guess no. Besides being a 32 bit OS, if you just magically figured out a way to use the extra RAM not recognized, chances are someone probably was thinking about that before us. And if so, everyone already knew that by now. And nobody knows, right?

I mean, you're probably thinking about overcoming the limitation just like what we used to do for the 2GB file limit in HDDs, right? (splitting into multiple files). Mind you, my computer knowledge is limited, I have no idea if you can use same rationale for more-ram-than-the-OS-can-chew.
post #10 of 11
draggono it seems you've been given a lot of conflicting and confusing responses here. I'll try to answer your questions for you.

Your 32 bit OS is limited to addressing 4GB RAM. If you install 4GB you won't be able to access all of it directly since the OS needs some of the address space for various overhead such as graphics card memory. 4GB will still be better than 2GB but how much depends a lot on which OS you're using. Vista will take advantage of the extra memory much better than XP will. You will probably see anywhere from 3.3GB to 3.6GB of available memory in Windows which is pretty close to the full 4GB and a lot more than 2GB. Windows limits it's applications in a 32bit environment to 2GB each but that still means that they'll be able to use a full 2GB (if they need it) without having to utilize the page file because there'll be plenty of extra memory for the OS and other things.

Vista is very good at using available memory and will run noticeably smoother and faster on a 4GB machine over a 2GB machine and will actually claim approximately 20-40% more memory for itself(I know this personally from direct testing).

XP will still use the same memory and won't run any more efficiently or smoother on a 4GB machine until you open enough applications to push that 2GB limit so it depends on what apps you use.

So if you use XP and never push more than 2GB total memory usage don't bother. If you use Vista go for it and get the 4GB! Vista really shines on a 4GB system.

As far as the RAMDisk idea....don't bother....here's why....With 4GB memory Windows probably won't every actually need the swap file and won't use it. If you make a RAMDisk for your swap file Windows will use it because it will be short on memory....it's kind of self defeating so there's no point. Besides, your swap file should be at least as large as your total system memory so it's not a good idea to use a 1GB fixed swap file with 3GB left over for Windows....best just to let Windows manage it. In an ideal environment you should put your swap file on a separate physical drive (not partition) but in a notebook you usually only have one drive and like I said before, with a 4GB system Windows will rarely use the swap file. Besides, I'm not even sure your idea would work to give you the full 4GB but IMO it's not worth trying.

About dual channel. I'm not sure why your notebook says it doesn't support dual channel so maybe because it's only got one stick installed now....not sure about that one but it could just be that particular motherboard doesn't support it. Like the others said, it's not a big deal and dual channel support offers negligible performance advantages with current Intel based systems anyway. Dual channel support is a bigger deal on older AMD based XP and A64 systems. With that in mind, 3GB would work well for you as well if you don't want to get the 4GB (resulting in 3.3 to 3.6GB of available system memory).

To find out what RAM you have installed now download this nice little application called CPU-Z from here:

http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php

Just run the app from within the folder (no installation required) and look under the "Memory" tab for what you memory is running at and under the "SPD" tab for complete information about your installed memory's supported speeds and latency.
post #11 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by wraithrsw View Post
Might as well get 4 to make it true dual channel. But 3's ok if price is what matters.
afik no laptop has dual channel built into the chipset, most dual channel set ups have 4 dimms IIRC

been a while for me, i maybe wrong


to OP, with the price of ram, youd be stupid not to put 4gb in any rig desktop or laptop
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