I will post what I choose to post regardless of your opinion of said post. If you don't like it, and/or you feel it is inappropiate feel free to report the post. This meaningless banter with you is just a waste of my time, and in the end your opinion of my posts means very little. Have a nice day Solo.
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nVidia 8700/8800/9600/9800 chips are failing across the board - Page 3
nVidia SEC filing attached (see page 24)
It should be noted that nVidia has admitted that [graphics boards] “are failing in the field at higher than normal rates,” and that “testing suggests a weak material set of die/package combination ..." [which is used in both desktop and notebook chips, but is less likey to manifest itself in desktops due to obvious reasons]
"Our products are complex and may contain defects or experience failures due to any number of issues in design, fabrication, packaging, materials and/or use within a system. If any of our products or technologies contains a defect, compatibility issue or other error, we may have to invest additional research and development efforts to find and correct the issue. Such efforts could divert our management’s and engineers’ attention from the development of new products and technologies and could increase our operating costs and reduce our gross margin. In addition, an error or defect in new products or releases or related software drivers after commencement of commercial shipments could result in failure to achieve market acceptance or loss of design wins. Also, we may be required to reimburse customers, including for customers’ costs to repair or replace the products in the field, which could cause our revenue to decline. A product recall or a significant number of product returns could be expensive, damage our reputation and could result in the shifting of business to our competitors. Costs associated with correcting defects, errors, bugs or other issues could be significant and could materially harm our financial results."
-nVidia
It should be noted that nVidia has admitted that [graphics boards] “are failing in the field at higher than normal rates,” and that “testing suggests a weak material set of die/package combination ..." [which is used in both desktop and notebook chips, but is less likey to manifest itself in desktops due to obvious reasons]
"Our products are complex and may contain defects or experience failures due to any number of issues in design, fabrication, packaging, materials and/or use within a system. If any of our products or technologies contains a defect, compatibility issue or other error, we may have to invest additional research and development efforts to find and correct the issue. Such efforts could divert our management’s and engineers’ attention from the development of new products and technologies and could increase our operating costs and reduce our gross margin. In addition, an error or defect in new products or releases or related software drivers after commencement of commercial shipments could result in failure to achieve market acceptance or loss of design wins. Also, we may be required to reimburse customers, including for customers’ costs to repair or replace the products in the field, which could cause our revenue to decline. A product recall or a significant number of product returns could be expensive, damage our reputation and could result in the shifting of business to our competitors. Costs associated with correcting defects, errors, bugs or other issues could be significant and could materially harm our financial results."
-nVidia
post #43 of 92
9/1/08 at 2:40pm
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rive...
How is it you assume a higher than normal failure rate means all Nvidia products are defective?
Is the sky falling too?
I have three computers right now running products you say are faulty, but I haven't had a single issue with any of them. And these machines run 12+ hours a day. How is that possible?
How is it you assume a higher than normal failure rate means all Nvidia products are defective?
Is the sky falling too?
I have three computers right now running products you say are faulty, but I haven't had a single issue with any of them. And these machines run 12+ hours a day. How is that possible?
post #44 of 92
9/1/08 at 2:43pm
post #45 of 92
9/2/08 at 4:37am
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post #46 of 92
9/2/08 at 4:57pm
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Quote:
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rive...
How is it you assume a higher than normal failure rate means all Nvidia products are defective? Is the sky falling too? I have three computers right now running products you say are faulty, but I haven't had a single issue with any of them. And these machines run 12+ hours a day. How is that possible? |
According to nVidia in their SEC filing these issues have now been resolved. (as of Aug, 2008)
post #48 of 92
9/2/08 at 10:13pm
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[quote=rive0108;2945481]Nvidia G92s and G94 reportedly failing
Desktop boards this time
By Charlie Demerjian: Tuesday, 12 August 2008, 9:35 AM
NVIDIA IS IN DEEP trouble over the defective parts problem, and from what we're being told, this is only the tip of the iceberg. NV still insists on stonewalling and spinning because the cost of owning up to the problem could very well sink the company.
If you haven't been following the story, the short version, up till now, is that all G84 and G86 chips are bad.
Seems like you said that all G84 and G86 chips are all bad in your first post and then you say that not all chips are defective which way is it? I doubt that every G84 and G86 card is going to fail... That is theoretically impossible odds.It would be like a tornado going through a junk yard and putting together a perfectly working 747 airplane....Not all m7700 laptops have had problems... The first rule in researching a problem is to do accurate research...secondary resources dont count in doing research you go for the primary resource which in this insistance is Nvidia or the SEC....
Desktop boards this time
By Charlie Demerjian: Tuesday, 12 August 2008, 9:35 AM
NVIDIA IS IN DEEP trouble over the defective parts problem, and from what we're being told, this is only the tip of the iceberg. NV still insists on stonewalling and spinning because the cost of owning up to the problem could very well sink the company.
If you haven't been following the story, the short version, up till now, is that all G84 and G86 chips are bad.
Seems like you said that all G84 and G86 chips are all bad in your first post and then you say that not all chips are defective which way is it? I doubt that every G84 and G86 card is going to fail... That is theoretically impossible odds.It would be like a tornado going through a junk yard and putting together a perfectly working 747 airplane....Not all m7700 laptops have had problems... The first rule in researching a problem is to do accurate research...secondary resources dont count in doing research you go for the primary resource which in this insistance is Nvidia or the SEC....
post #49 of 92
9/3/08 at 12:47am
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You guys, even those with elevated privileges need to lay off this guy.
I can understand a little AW clan circling the wagons, but this is a NV topic for god sake.
This guy is doing this community a service IMO by gathering and posting what (may) be very relevant information about a (possible) snafu by a major vendor. Tom's is one of the highest rep. hardware sites on the inter-tubes.
Aside from a little double posting at best this guy isnt violating any forum rules that I can tell(Ive had far more egregious usurps of this boards policies go unchecked in the past, be polite ask not to double post or any other board violation, dont flame him for god sake). He's been flame baited and still seems to keep a good level of netiquette (well beyond what I could tolerate for sure)
If you dont like his opinions quit reading his threads/posts, if you dislike his links/facts/info, post some counters.......
But this reads like an epic dog pile of a drive by posting reading "AW Sucks and so does its owners"
Only time will tell how deep this defective NV rabbit hole will go.
In the mean time, layoff this guy, I personally appreciate the smattering of (albeit negative NV info) gathered into a single thread. Instead of bashing this guy, post a link to a reputable site or analyst saying this problem is indeed no big deal.
***Wow Im dizzy, being the voice of reason is against my nature and I think Im getting nauseous***
I can understand a little AW clan circling the wagons, but this is a NV topic for god sake.
This guy is doing this community a service IMO by gathering and posting what (may) be very relevant information about a (possible) snafu by a major vendor. Tom's is one of the highest rep. hardware sites on the inter-tubes.
Aside from a little double posting at best this guy isnt violating any forum rules that I can tell(Ive had far more egregious usurps of this boards policies go unchecked in the past, be polite ask not to double post or any other board violation, dont flame him for god sake). He's been flame baited and still seems to keep a good level of netiquette (well beyond what I could tolerate for sure)
If you dont like his opinions quit reading his threads/posts, if you dislike his links/facts/info, post some counters.......
But this reads like an epic dog pile of a drive by posting reading "AW Sucks and so does its owners"
Only time will tell how deep this defective NV rabbit hole will go.
In the mean time, layoff this guy, I personally appreciate the smattering of (albeit negative NV info) gathered into a single thread. Instead of bashing this guy, post a link to a reputable site or analyst saying this problem is indeed no big deal.
***Wow Im dizzy, being the voice of reason is against my nature and I think Im getting nauseous***
post #50 of 92
9/3/08 at 1:55pm
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Quote:
|
You guys, even those with elevated privileges need to lay off this guy.
I can understand a little AW clan circling the wagons, but this is a NV topic for god sake. This guy is doing this community a service IMO by gathering and posting what (may) be very relevant information about a (possible) snafu by a major vendor. Tom's is one of the highest rep. hardware sites on the inter-tubes. Aside from a little double posting at best this guy isnt violating any forum rules that I can tell(Ive had far more egregious usurps of this boards policies go unchecked in the past, be polite ask not to double post or any other board violation, dont flame him for god sake). He's been flame baited and still seems to keep a good level of netiquette (well beyond what I could tolerate for sure) If you dont like his opinions quit reading his threads/posts, if you dislike his links/facts/info, post some counters....... But this reads like an epic dog pile of a drive by posting reading "AW Sucks and so does its owners" Only time will tell how deep this defective NV rabbit hole will go. In the mean time, layoff this guy, I personally appreciate the smattering of (albeit negative NV info) gathered into a single thread. Instead of bashing this guy, post a link to a reputable site or analyst saying this problem is indeed no big deal. ***Wow Im dizzy, being the voice of reason is against my nature and I think Im getting nauseous*** |
Simply not the case.
While bringing this issue to the attention of the forum isn't a problem, spamming every string that someone is having an issue, no matter how isolated or minor by telling them Alienware makes defective laptops, and nVidia graphics are all defective is not helpful. All this does is freak out new users that more than likely have a minor issue, and causes needless upset for people that just put a lot of money into a system.
post #51 of 92
9/3/08 at 4:33pm
It seems to be indeed a large issue but much of what is being handled right now is just pure speculation. As Arch said, only time will tell how deep the problem really is and that we should not jump to conclusions that EVERY single product shipped out is defective.
While there have been cards that may have kicked the bucket I don't see the rest of cards shipped worldwide that are doing so in masse at the same time.
I have purchased four Dell laptops in the past year with 8400's and a 8600 and they have been working fine. The 8600 on my desktop system hasn't shown any trouble either and neither have the 8xxx cards I have put on a couple of commissioned builds I have made.
They have even gone through a couple of all day long LAN parties.
While there have been cards that may have kicked the bucket I don't see the rest of cards shipped worldwide that are doing so in masse at the same time.
I have purchased four Dell laptops in the past year with 8400's and a 8600 and they have been working fine. The 8600 on my desktop system hasn't shown any trouble either and neither have the 8xxx cards I have put on a couple of commissioned builds I have made.
They have even gone through a couple of all day long LAN parties.
post #52 of 92
9/5/08 at 6:10pm
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[quote=littlefrankus;2951710]
Read this...we are told all G92 and G94 variants are susceptible [to the same problem as the G84, and G86] ...
I did not say ALL nvidia chips are bad. Just the G8/G9 series [have the weak die issue] This is a defect that can and is resulting in failure, but it is not a foregone conclusion that all G84, G86, G92, G94 cards will fail. Preventing overheating is the crux, but just because a defective card hasn't failed yet doesn't mean it wont suffer failure in 1, or even 2 years from now as a result of the defect. (Futhermore, Geforce 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 series gpu's obviously are not suffering from the weak die hence Not all nVidia chips are bad)
Quote:
|
Nvidia G92s and G94 reportedly failing
Desktop boards this time By Charlie Demerjian: Tuesday, 12 August 2008, 9:35 AM NVIDIA IS IN DEEP trouble over the defective parts problem, and from what we're being told, this is only the tip of the iceberg. NV still insists on stonewalling and spinning because the cost of owning up to the problem could very well sink the company. If you haven't been following the story, the short version, up till now, is that all G84 and G86 chips are bad. Seems like you said that all G84 and G86 chips are all bad in your first post and then you say that not all chips are defective which way is it? I doubt that every G84 and G86 card is going to fail... That is theoretically impossible odds.It would be like a tornado going through a junk yard and putting together a perfectly working 747 airplane....Not all m7700 laptops have had problems... The first rule in researching a problem is to do accurate research...secondary resources dont count in doing research you go for the primary resource which in this insistance is Nvidia or the SEC.... |
Read this...we are told all G92 and G94 variants are susceptible [to the same problem as the G84, and G86] ...
I did not say ALL nvidia chips are bad. Just the G8/G9 series [have the weak die issue] This is a defect that can and is resulting in failure, but it is not a foregone conclusion that all G84, G86, G92, G94 cards will fail. Preventing overheating is the crux, but just because a defective card hasn't failed yet doesn't mean it wont suffer failure in 1, or even 2 years from now as a result of the defect. (Futhermore, Geforce 2, 3, 4, 6, 7 series gpu's obviously are not suffering from the weak die hence Not all nVidia chips are bad)
post #54 of 92
9/6/08 at 1:07am
- littlefrankus
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You clearly stated that all G92 and G94 are bad...now you are stating that they are susceptible... so now you position has changed to where not all the G92 and G94 cards are defective and are not all going to fail....
there's a difference in all G92 and G94 are susceptible and your previous post stating that G92 and G94 are all bad... And if you could read my post I stated that you said all the G92 and G94 are bad... I never mentioned the other series... I guess you need to read alittle bit before bashing what I said...
there's a difference in all G92 and G94 are susceptible and your previous post stating that G92 and G94 are all bad... And if you could read my post I stated that you said all the G92 and G94 are bad... I never mentioned the other series... I guess you need to read alittle bit before bashing what I said...
Quote:
|
You clearly stated that all G92 and G94 are bad...now you are stating that they are susceptible... so now you position has changed to where not all the G92 and G94 cards are defective and are not all going to fail....
there's a difference in all G92 and G94 are susceptible and your previous post stating that G92 and G94 are all bad... And if you could read my post I stated that you said all the G92 and G94 are bad... I never mentioned the other series... I guess you need to read alittle bit before bashing what I said... |
Quote:
|
"This guy" is not doing anyone a service. He's jumping into every post where someone is having an issue, and telling them they've got a defective product.
Simply not the case. While bringing this issue to the attention of the forum isn't a problem, spamming every string that someone is having an issue, no matter how isolated or minor by telling them Alienware makes defective laptops, and nVidia graphics are all defective is not helpful. All this does is freak out new users that more than likely have a minor issue, and causes needless upset for people that just put a lot of money into a system. |
Let's let someone else base a conclusion on that...
BTW I thought community Reps were supposed to be more helpful, and not so rude...
I also thought this was an open forum where everyone was free discuss ideas, issues, etc. To flame someone because they have a difference of opinion, or bring to the surface controversial issues that you would rather see swept under the rug just seems wrong.
post #57 of 92
9/6/08 at 3:00am
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Quote:
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They are bad in the sense that they too have a defective die... (defective product = bad product) -Marketing 101
|
Just because every chip doesnt fail in a spectacular manner or in at all does not mean its not defective imo. That is if you only correlate defective to failure, rather than higher than industry accepted failure rates as defective. Just because a you have a launch xbox360 that hasnt failed, I still consider it defective because it has a much higher probability of failure than successive updates in the line or similar products in the market be it a PS3 or a blender.
Quote:
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I gotta agree here defective = bad, *not so much about the marketing statement.
Just because every chip doesnt fail in a spectacular manner or in at all does not mean its not defective imo. That is if you only correlate defective to failure, rather than higher than industry accepted failure rates as defective. Just because a you have a launch xbox360 that hasnt failed, I still consider it defective because it has a much higher probability of failure than successive updates in the line or similar products in the market be it a PS3 or a blender. |
Thank You, I think.
post #59 of 92
9/6/08 at 9:50am
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Quote:
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BTW I thought community Reps were supposed to be more helpful, and not so rude...
I also thought this was an open forum where everyone was free discuss ideas, issues, etc. To flame someone because they have a difference of opinion, or bring to the surface controversial issues that you would rather see swept under the rug just seems wrong. |
Fact: Nvidia has owed up to their problem just as Sony is doing with theirs.
Fact: The issue has not been swept under the rug. So dont state that it has.
post #60 of 92
9/6/08 at 9:57am
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