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M9700 testing with Geforce 7950 GTX and ATi Radeon 3870 (x2)

post #1 of 18
11/26/08 at 3:43am
Thread Starter 
Ok, this is just a follow-up on my series of tests regarding the GPU amongst the Alienware M97xx series and the OCZ Whitebook, know here as the Alienware M17. Now, I've already shown what happens with the M9750 and the ATi 3870 x2 (2 GPU cards) from the OCZ Whitebook/AW 17. This is shown here. Now it's the M9700's turn. For those who forgot, the M9700 was the first iteration of the Arima dual GPU chassis via SLi that used the AMD single core Turion and came in three colors. Thanks to a member here at NBR (mlee49), we can now try what done on the M9750.

First, here are the pictures of all the MXM-III GPUs from Arima (except the 8700M GT):

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/9817/ArimaGPUs.jpg

Now here are some results:

The M9700 DOES boot up with a 7950 GTX card from the M9750. Because I only had 1 card, I couldn't try SLi, though I assume that it would work. Installation was pretty straight forward as it's the same as installing a new graphics card for a desktop. Due to some conditions of the notebook received, I couldn't do any gaming benchmarks, but I took screenshots of the temperatures and ran 3dmark06, which are shown here:

Screenshot with idle temps:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8497/m97007950.jpg

^In fairness, and due to lack of space, the notebook was sitting on a bed, and I applied a small amount of thermal grease. From my experience with the M9750, subtract about 8 degrees from that figure as well from the 3d06 temps, which will be shown later.

3dmark06 scores with a SINGLE 7950 GTX in the M9700:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/3...0079503d06.jpg

Temperatures after the run (subtract about 8 degrees, as mentioned before):

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8...03d06temps.jpg

Now for the ATi card(s)...

Now this is a pic of the M9700 with both ATi cards installed:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/2197/M97003870s.jpg

BUT, oddly enough, the ATi cards did NOT work, both the single and dual GPU setup. What happens is that it boots to the BIOS screen with the alien head, but then it freezes. The GPU fans are blasted at full speed and the same screen is there. I was able to enter the BIOS configuration screen, but after I exit, it freezes that screen and the same problem again. I touched the GPU sinks afterwards, but it didn't feel hot at all.

I'm guessing it's a chipset issue or possibly a BIOS issue. The M9700 uses an nVidia nForce chipset, while the M9750 is a hybrid between nVidia and intel. Also, I noticed that the M9700 requires a battery for it to run on AC (meaning that if you take out the battery and run on AC, it won't boot up), while the M9750 can...or it just might be this notebook in particular due to the AC input issue the owner is having.

So there you have it pretty much, M9700 can handle a 7950 GTX, but not an ATi 3870[x2] for now.
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post #2 of 18
11/26/08 at 1:10pm
this is awesome to hear d00d. what was the 3dmark 06 score? i it worth the upgrade????
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post #3 of 18
11/26/08 at 2:26pm
I think your m9700 has issues... Mine boots fine without the battery when plugged in.
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post #4 of 18
11/26/08 at 9:25pm
yea mine too I actually use mine without re battery because it basically like by desktop it never moves
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post #5 of 18
11/27/08 at 12:52am
Thread Starter 
Ok, it's probably this one in particular due to the AC input being messed up I guess. Anyways, OP is updated with pics.
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post #6 of 18
11/27/08 at 12:02pm
any luck with two 7950s and where culd I buy em
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post #7 of 18
11/29/08 at 3:03pm
So this means that 8700 cards could possibly work in the 9700. That would be a decent upgrade for those wanting DX10.
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post #8 of 18
12/15/08 at 3:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AReallyBigMan View Post
Ok, this is just a follow-up on my series of tests regarding the GPU amongst the Alienware M97xx series and the OCZ Whitebook, know here as the Alienware M17. Now, I've already shown what happens with the M9750 and the ATi 3870 x2 (2 GPU cards) from the OCZ Whitebook/AW 17. This is shown here. Now it's the M9700's turn. For those who forgot, the M9700 was the first iteration of the Arima dual GPU chassis via SLi that used the AMD single core Turion and came in three colors. Thanks to a member here at NBR (mlee49), we can now try what done on the M9750.

First, here are the pictures of all the MXM-III GPUs from Arima (except the 8700M GT):

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/9817/ArimaGPUs.jpg

Now here are some results:

The M9700 DOES boot up with a 7950 GTX card from the M9750. Because I only had 1 card, I couldn't try SLi, though I assume that it would work. Installation was pretty straight forward as it's the same as installing a new graphics card for a desktop. Due to some conditions of the notebook received, I couldn't do any gaming benchmarks, but I took screenshots of the temperatures and ran 3dmark06, which are shown here:

Screenshot with idle temps:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8497/m97007950.jpg

^In fairness, and due to lack of space, the notebook was sitting on a bed, and I applied a small amount of thermal grease. From my experience with the M9750, subtract about 8 degrees from that figure as well from the 3d06 temps, which will be shown later.

3dmark06 scores with a SINGLE 7950 GTX in the M9700:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/3...0079503d06.jpg

Temperatures after the run (subtract about 8 degrees, as mentioned before):

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8...03d06temps.jpg

Now for the ATi card(s)...

Now this is a pic of the M9700 with both ATi cards installed:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/2197/M97003870s.jpg

BUT, oddly enough, the ATi cards did NOT work, both the single and dual GPU setup. What happens is that it boots to the BIOS screen with the alien head, but then it freezes. The GPU fans are blasted at full speed and the same screen is there. I was able to enter the BIOS configuration screen, but after I exit, it freezes that screen and the same problem again. I touched the GPU sinks afterwards, but it didn't feel hot at all.

I'm guessing it's a chipset issue or possibly a BIOS issue. The M9700 uses an nVidia nForce chipset, while the M9750 is a hybrid between nVidia and intel. Also, I noticed that the M9700 requires a battery for it to run on AC (meaning that if you take out the battery and run on AC, it won't boot up), while the M9750 can...or it just might be this notebook in particular due to the AC input issue the owner is having.

So there you have it pretty much, M9700 can handle a 7950 GTX, but not an ATi 3870[x2] for now.
Are you sure you have not messed up. On your photos I see 3 7900gs cards. As I tested 7950gtx with label D can be installed in m9700 laptop as primary card. With label P nothing will come up. What about 3870 cards? Did you try to test them in single install in m9750 laptop. I thought with the one with label s suppose to work on its own. With no SLI. In m9700 laptop try power adapter for osz to give it more power. 7900gs consumes 30watt, 7950 45watt, 2 3870 110watt. bear in mind.
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post #9 of 18
12/15/08 at 3:54pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by eugene2878 View Post
Are you sure you have not messed up. On your photos I see 3 7900gs cards. As I tested 7950gtx with label D can be installed in m9700 laptop as primary card. With label P nothing will come up. What about 3870 cards? Did you try to test them in single install in m9750 laptop. I thought with the one with label s suppose to work on its own. With no SLI. In m9700 laptop try power adapter for osz to give it more power. 7900gs consumes 30watt, 7950 45watt, 2 3870 110watt. bear in mind.
The 7900 GS and the 7950 GTX look identical. If you see the screenshot with the GPU-Z, you can see that it is in fact a 7950 GTX. I assume the label D and P mean "Daughter" and "Parent" respectively. If anything, the Parent card would need to go in the center socket, while the Daughter card goes in the side socket. Switching them would result in what you seemed to experience.

As I mentioned before, I tried both single and dual configurations with the ATi cards with both setups yielding the same result. I also used a 180w PSU from the M9750 (the M9700 comes with a 150w PSU) to accomodate for the extra power the dual ATi GPU setup consumes.
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post #10 of 18
12/15/08 at 4:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AReallyBigMan View Post
The 7900 GS and the 7950 GTX look identical. If you see the screenshot with the GPU-Z, you can see that it is in fact a 7950 GTX. I assume the label D and P mean "Daughter" and "Parent" respectively. If anything, the Parent card would need to go in the center socket, while the Daughter card goes in the side socket. Switching them would result in what you seemed to experience.

As I mentioned before, I tried both single and dual configurations with the ATi cards with both setups yielding the same result. I also used a 180w PSU from the M9750 (the M9700 comes with a 150w PSU) to accomodate for the extra power the dual ATi GPU setup consumes.
So does 3870 master card work in m9750 as a single card?
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post #11 of 18
12/19/08 at 8:18pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by eugene2878 View Post
So does 3870 master card work in m9750 as a single card?
http://www.notebookforums.com/thread222763.html
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post #12 of 18
7/16/09 at 9:38am

Need your help urgently

I installed a daughter 7950gtx into the primary slot of my m9700. On start up I hear the normal beeps but there is no signal on the screen.


As you can understand I'm feeling pretty anxious. Please if anyone has any basic ideas let me know because I've never tried replacing a card before and not sure where to begin troubleshooting. Any replies much appreciated.
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post #13 of 18
7/16/09 at 10:58am
Have you tried plugging something in to the output port on your notebook to see if you can video on an external monitor?
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post #14 of 18
7/17/09 at 12:23pm
Tried an external monitor but that just gets another black screen. Will try fiddling around tonight, but really not got many ideas
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post #15 of 18
7/17/09 at 12:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by m9700tipu View Post
Tried an external monitor but that just gets another black screen. Will try fiddling around tonight, but really not got many ideas
You did toggle the FN+F key back and forth a few times?

cheers ...
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post #16 of 18
7/17/09 at 5:03pm
I just tried toggling, you got my hopes up with that! Still a completely blank screen even with monitor. It's frustrating, I can hear vista boot up and I can even blindly log in. I wonder if the author of this thread used the stock
powersupply? I give up. Thought it would be easy to emulate his results.
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post #17 of 18
10/16/09 at 4:14pm
My experience with the m9700, 7900 GS and 7950 GTX.

First of all, to address the issue of daughter and parent cards. The Daughter card is the Master. Goes in the slot next to the CPU and works if there is nothing wrong with your notebook or the way you installed it. The Parent is the Slave. Goes in the slot away from the CPU and is needed for SLI. This does not make sense but it is how it works.

Performance with the 7950 GTX is not as good as 7900 GSes in SLI mode. 7950 GTX in SLI mode is worse than a single 7950 GTX in standalone.

I have been using the following driver from http://tweakforce.com/ XG_Mobile_177.92_XP_32bit.exe.

I am going to try different drivers to see if I can get better performance.

If anyone has any advice please let me know. I would really like to up the performance on my m9700.
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post #18 of 18
10/24/09 at 6:01am
I have been testing the m9700 with the 7900GS and 7950GTX in single and SLI modes. I have come to a few conclusions. 1) The 7950GTX runs too hot for the m9700 in single and especially SLI mode; 2) The 7900GS in SLI mode outperforms the 7950GTX in single or SLI mode and 3) The 7950 GTX in SLI mode draws more power than the system can provide, which is probably why the system performs so poorly in SLI mode.

When I was running the m9700 with a single 7950GTX (3DMark06 4815) its performance was almost 500 points lower than the system with two 7900GSes in SLI mode (3DMark06 5298). The best 3DMark06 score of 4815 from the m9700 with a single 7950GTX was with the driver XG_Mobile_177.92_XP_32bit.exe from http://tweakforce.com/. I could not find that driver anymore but they have a newer one XTreme-G_182.06m_XP_32bit.exe that gave a score of 4810. This is an insignificant difference in my opinion. With the 191.56 driver from www.laptopvideo2go.com the best 3DMark06 score from the m9700 and a single 9750GTX was 4708.

The m9700 with 7950GTXes in SLI mode was abysmal. The best 3dMark score I had was 3467. This was 2 points better than a single 7900GS (3DMark06 3462). Even worse were the heat issues with the two 7950GTXes. The temperatures were 71 and 72 degrees Celsius. That is 10 to 12 degrees higher than the 7900GSes. This is just asking for overheating problems. Also, the power draw was higher than the PSU could supply. The battery could not charge with the draw from the 2 7950GTX cards. I have read the heat sink and fan from the m97590 will not work in the m9700.The other issue is getting more power to the cards. Not sure if the PSU from the m9750 would work in the m9700 but maybe it could.

The biggest issue was the heat. When running with a single 7950GTX the GPU was 60 degrees Celsius. This would not seem like an issue when knowing that the GPU temps of the two 7900GSes in SLI mode were 59 and 61 degrees Celsius, respectively. However, when I took the machine away from the laptops cooler and played a game the system fan came on at high speed and the laptop shutdown within 10 minutes of starting the game. This has never happened with the machine using the 7900GSes in SLI mode. The system did not shutdown with the 7950GTX from overheating when using the laptop cooler. To me this does not matter since the performance for the 7950GTX did not get the same performance as the 7900GSes in SLI mode.

It is not all negative news for the 7950GTX though. A single 7950GTX (3DMark06 4815) far outperformed a single 7900GS (3DMark06 3462). So if you have a single 7900GS, and cannot find another one, then getting a single 7950GTX would improve your performance greatly. Be sure you buy the daughter card if you get a single 7950GTX since that is the Master/Primary card. Please take measures to keep your system cool though. When playing games it will be mandatory to have a cooler for your laptop. Might need it for playing DVD’s but I did not test that scenario. When doing other tasks that do not require lots of GPU processing than a laptop cooler will probably not be necessary.

Pictures
http://img243.imageshack.us/i/7900gssli.jpg/
http://img4.imageshack.us/i/7950gtxsingle.jpg/
http://img148.imageshack.us/i/7950gtxsli.jpg/

3DMark06 Benchmarks (Idle Temps Celsius)
7900GS-SLI: 5298 (59/61)
7950GTX-Single: 4815 (60)
7900GTX-SLI: 3467 (71/72)
7900GS-Single: 3462 (N/A)

System
Alienware M9700
2x 7900GS in SLI mode
Windows XP Service Pack 3
100MB 7200 rpm HD
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