New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Finely got it in... 3790 - Page 2

post #21 of 42
9/22/04 at 4:29pm
Thread Starter 
Well it seems to be better, the touchpad gets warm still but oh well.

So what could have caused my batter loss and features?
Reply
Reply
post #22 of 42
9/22/04 at 5:02pm
so what is your total cost on the system? how much did you save?

i know you said you paid 1567 but is that with tax and shipping?

what are the cpu / hdd / memory / Screen / Battery

i looked at RJ tech page and the bearbone is 1019, so you have 550 to work with CPU / HDD / MEMORY. can you list the detail spec of the system.

just want to compare what you have build, vs what pctorque would have cost.
Reply
Reply
post #23 of 42
9/22/04 at 6:53pm
Thread Starter 
Yes it was with shipping.

n3790 WSXGA+
12 cell battery
DVD/CD-RW Combo Drive
1.7 Dothan
60 gig 5200 RPM 16 meg cache HDD
(1) 512 meg PC2700
Intel Wireless BG

its a kick but system, after my modification on it it runs better. I deleted windows and I am in the process of putting windows back. As of before SP2 it has all fuctions. The heat thing is still an issue, I think in the long run I may end up sending it for repairs before the warntee runs out, this kinda heat buildup cant be good. But it seems to be under control. The fans seem to come on my frequent. Keep in mind while I lapped the heatsink and all that fun stuff I pull the battery and bios batter for a total reset. Seems to work better as I said before

The system is warm to the touch 105F but not hot.

I configured just now and im 100 bucks cheaper and thats without shipping. You sadly have to log on to figure out what it is. But I would expect 25 bucks.
Reply
Reply
post #24 of 42
9/22/04 at 9:00pm
so for 100 to 150 bucks, you lose the option to get replacmeent parts from a single source. like if your HDD goes bad you have to contact where you bought the HDD or who made the HDD. same with MEMORY and ofcorse the CPU you would just contact INTEL and hope they offer advance replacement.

also without the option to have a place to send the complete system in for troubleshotting, you have to do the just which is the bad part is it the CPU / MEMORY / Motherboard that has gone bad on your own like you are doing now.

i don't see how the 100 to 150 bucks is worth the saving. i will have to stick with buying the NP9860 direct from sager like my 8890 and 8790. where i have the option to just call sager then drop by and get what needs to be replaced, replaced by them.
Reply
Reply
post #25 of 42
9/23/04 at 12:18am
Thread Starter 
simple add in 3 or lifetime warntee on most times and figure how much that ads
Reply
Reply
post #26 of 42
9/23/04 at 12:51am
I wish it's that simple, it's the extra leg work you have to deal with when sometihng goes wrong, since you now have R&J , Intel , HDD brand, memory brand. that's 4 vs 1

what will you do when you can't figure out if it's the Intel CPU is bad or the motherboard is?

do you take everything out and send the system to R&J tech and will they install their own CPU / memory / hdd matching what you have for testing? or do you send your complete system to R&J and hope everything will return as is? since the CPU / Memory / HDD is not theirs and it's not in their DATABASE that it was sold by them.

now if you send them barebone only and they say everything test ok and then send your system back, then you RMA the CPU with intel that's alot of down time.

you send them the complete system, they said yeah the cpu is the one that's at fault but since it isn't theirs you have to do rma for it your self and ship it back to you. that is also alot of down time.

or you can RMA the cpu first and then find out it's really the motherboard that's bad. but no mater what you do it seems to be alot more down time then it has to be when you only deal with one company since you now have to take your time shipping 2 items around.

desktops are pretty much the same only difference is the parts to help trubleshoot is much more easy to come by. i'm not sure how easy you'll be able to get a P-M CPU or another P-M notebook for you to trubleshoot. you already have to BUY the extra memory from bestbuy while your bad one is in the process getting replaced?

all to just save 150 bucks.
Reply
Reply
post #27 of 42
9/23/04 at 1:20am
Hrm as said before you're the only guy building his own lappy, and I can say my 3790 gets a bit warm on the left side but that's it. Touchpad is fine and everything else is fine. Doesn't even get 1/2 as warm as the 4780. My 4780 hard drive idled around 45-50 degrees C and it gets up to 50-60 on the CPU. My 3790 doesn't get up to that at all from what I can tell. It does a really good job at handling the heat. I will need to check it out but I do believe your system is hotter then normal.

Furthermore I tend to agree with tenchi. Laptops are good if you know 100% exactly what you are doing and what you're going to do. Resellers save a lot of money because they buy hardware in large quantaties so they pass the savings onto you. If you bought the stuff yourself you're paying more for the hardware than Sager did. Same reason people goto Sam's Club and get giant rolls of soap or 6 packs of deodorants. ;P
Reply
Reply
post #28 of 42
9/23/04 at 2:44am
Thread Starter 
i want to know what degree people think as warm. And from what I can tell by the thermal design of this notebook it can very well happen.

Im going to try to press it, but from what i seen it running warm does not qualify it being abnormal. Clevo Japan reports its normal for serveral spots to be 120F+ in some areas such as the left plam rist, upper left, and entire metal plate under the keyboard, and sometimes the touchpad. I just seem to have all of it. I might be courious to what revision you have?. Just seems to be poorly themral designed. The fans are seeming to work correctly because they do come on, but they would truely do work if they where on period and rev'ed up when needed.

So again I ask what programs do you use to figure out what the temp of the CPU is?
Reply
Reply
post #29 of 42
9/23/04 at 2:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HardTech
shouldnt the fans barely be running as to provide basic airflow? This is what bugging me. All anyone has ever said is the fact the left palm gets warm. nothing about the entire computer gets hot, and the touchpad is a burning inferno.

So I was wondering is there a heat program that works on the puppy. Im getting an infared thermal defice to check out the heat. Seeing how no one believes me(even RJTech doesnt beleive me... im questioning support now). I was post in other put there is more chances of help here than any other place.
No, the fans only kick on when needed. They do go full blast when you first power on the machine, but only for a few seconds. If they aren't doing that then you may have something wrong. Sounds like yours is getting hotter than most though. The only part of mine that gets warm is left of the touchpad.

Mobilemeter will give you the temp of your hd, but as of yet there is no way to monitor a Dothans temp.
Reply
Reply
post #30 of 42
9/23/04 at 3:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HardTech
Yes it was with shipping.

n3790 WSXGA+
12 cell battery
DVD/CD-RW Combo Drive
1.7 Dothan
60 gig 5200 RPM 16 meg cache HDD
(1) 512 meg PC2700
Intel Wireless BG
You paid 1567 right? That exact same config is 1600 at Discountlaptops, pre-built.
Reply
Reply
post #31 of 42
9/23/04 at 3:37am
Thread Starter 
yeah but the thing is some parts have lifetime, and others are 3 years. It may be a hassle but ive seen a few people complain about the memory going bad because of heat. Or a HDD going bad because of heat.

The notebook has a 3 year warrantee on it, 1 year free from visa and another year from my insurance when the visa warrantee expires.

The CPU is a 5 (3+1+1) year life
The HDD is 5 (3+1+1) year
The memory is life...

So I am failing to see where I got less than others. But now that finely someone confirmed that the fans do indeed stay off until they come on I feel a bit better. Granted it runs warm, but I think this has to because its thermal wise poorly built. Taking it to my friends senior engineering class next week for them to have a look see. They are looking at thermal dynamics so it should prove interesting. It just means ill have to forgo having a notebook for a week and not knowing where it is. I can guarantee you someone is signing this sucker out
Reply
Reply
post #32 of 42
9/23/04 at 12:27pm
I suppose people here are also counting all the hours you've spent in putting everything together.

From the sounds of it, you've probably spent probably over a hundred hours putting the laptop together, diagnosing issues, sending things back, shopping for replacement parts, etc, etc.

For most people, that's almost directly translatable to time they could have spent on other endeavours. As the old saying goes: time is money.

And while each of your component has a warranty, you still don't have a consolidated warranty - nobody that will take your laptop in without having you jump through a lot of hoops, or give you a lot of runaround telling you to check other components.

In any case, I hope I haven't rained on your parade - I actually commend you on building your own laptop. It's probably something I don't have the guts for right now. Perhaps later, when more pioneers like you have paved the road for the rest of us.
Reply
Reply
post #33 of 42
9/23/04 at 1:28pm
Thread Starter 
nah you didn’t destroy hopes. I just don’t see why this one is hotter than others. But the whole thing is in thermal specs according to Clevo Japan (hehe, thank god for free long distance including overseas on my cell phone... i would have to died to see that bill . I waited on hold for a near half hour while they got an english speaking engineer on the phone)

From what I can understand from him, hot sports are normal, and the entire thing can get hot. Before Clevo calls it defective one area would have to be more than 120F. But hes seen some complains on the first gen's that the whole thing heats up near that temp.

It just seems weird this is within thermal design specs for the notebook

Now ive spoken to the HDD manufacture the heat the HDD i reporting is fine, and within specs for it to operate safely. But the memory company seemed concerned that there product was in this whole mess, but it should operate under those conditions. And if it blows out due to heat they will replace it with no questions asked, almost near the same was said from Intel PR rep.

The Intel rep I spoke to that basically gave me the 1.7 to test was concerned and will be speaking with Clevo on this subject. So again this may prove entertaining from my part. I got a semi defective 3790 that’s within design specs.

Now so not to scare people off from PCT, or Sager products in general im sure if this happened to you guys they would swap it for you.

Again I would like to thank the owners of this board for allowing this to stay. I have tried very hard to imply that the product I bought was not your brand and I hope you would have taken care of it. It would have been cool to get your opinion on this, and if you have heard of any issues. But I can also see why it may be the best interest to stay out of the subject as well. But again I would like to thank you for allowing this to stay up.
Reply
Reply
post #34 of 42
9/23/04 at 1:59pm
Thread Starter 
Well I checked out discountlaptops and they are 1641.03 for the same specs
Reply
Reply
post #35 of 42
9/23/04 at 8:04pm
1600 cash (not an option for some and even them the bank fees often come close to the credit price anyway), 1641 credit, then ~30 for shipping & you're looking at ~100 saved - plus the extra warranties and the exact parts/brands you wanted. Up to each to decide whether that's worth it
Reply
Reply
post #36 of 42
9/24/04 at 1:11am
I think you weren't able to get much help here because you are the first one that built one. Your pics of the assembly process would surely help out others trying the same thing.

btw, can you tell me how to get the keyboard out of this thing?
Reply
Reply
post #37 of 42
9/24/04 at 4:27am
Thread Starter 
the way to lift that area up (keyboard) is in the back behind the F keys. There is no internal plasic tabs like there is on the front parts. All that keeps it in one place are small molded in plasic peices (so no worry) that you can simply and easly pop it over. I did it with easy pressure from my hand. it helps if you pus it toward you (touch pad) and then come up with it. There is plasic tabs on the other side so once it comes up just barely pull away from you so you make sure you dont bend the tabs on the keyboard.

Below you will find a huge metal sheet. its entire purpose is a heatsink...

But the conducter for this is horrid. A foamish type padding (prolly to help keep a short circut from happening.)

Im not sure as to what chipset processor it is, but it seems to be one of the main issues for heat. But with it having this padding its also the lead source to the keyboard flex.

Ill get more pics tomorrow. but that padding isnt the greatest idea for a themral design.
Reply
Reply
post #38 of 42
9/24/04 at 6:41am
Thread Starter 
ive been useing it tonight for quite some time. Im not sure why but the temps seems to be getting in normal ranges. There are cool spots starting to show up on the case. The weird thing is my habbit hasnt changed that much. On the IR thermal sensore its shows on avg a 5F drop. The only think I did was to pop off the metal over off under the keyboard.

It looks like I was right about where post of the heat comes from. I am in a diffent section of the room but ive had my fans on high and its been a nice 76F all week. So im at a loss. Im gonna tear this thing down, and see if maybe the gfx card need to be reseated.
Reply
Reply
post #39 of 42
9/24/04 at 2:28pm
If we are talking about the same paddings i have in my sold 8890 and current 8790, they work quite well in heat transfer. they are made to conduct heat.

they are not solid, it's more like gel / goo that was used long ago in the P3 days made into a jelly pad. it's quite cold to the touch if you leave it there for a bit, then heats up if you turn on the system.

i don't think it's worth the time to be doing everything you are doing, hell i can't even be sure if the system really has a fault, or did you just not have put everything back together the way it should have been. one of these "PADDINGS" might have moved out of place and it's no longer transfer the heat it should be doing.

a while back in the Nvidia TNT2 days i had one the card worked great for months, until i got bore and wanted to remove the double side taped heat sink on the card for unknow reason. sticked it back the way it was with the old heat transfer double side tape i made sure the sticky side did not get dirty, and the card has been truble since then.

until i lied to i think it was Diamond, that the heat sink felt off in the case!! must be due to the heat. and they send me a new heatsink with new tape, after replacing it the card is working truble free again.

looking at the old heatsink i notice air bubble between the tape, which i think must of caused heat traps or were just not transfering the heat well enought anymore.
Reply
Reply
post #40 of 42
9/24/04 at 5:11pm
Thread Starter 
Well it may be, im looking into it. But its not gel like, you can tell its a foam. Just seems weird that with all that they could use. And because of that foam, it pushes up on the metal holder, thus causeing the flex of the keyboardi guess im gonna have to see what the them right off the chip is, and then see what the heat is right directly above the heat sink when the thermal pad is applied to see how well its working.

Just doesnt seem right to me.

If anyone ever wants to know how to build one, just ask. It only took 10-15 mins max. Took longer unscrewing then it did to assemble.

(I leave the wireless card out of that build time. The aux antenna did not want to go on. it was alot of force beofre it snapped in.

As for the lost of fuctions I had earlier. I blame this on windows being screwed. I did a reinstall and all patchs to date with no issues. The only problem I had was with the new omegas drivers. So I just did the ATI driver mod and it works great.
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Sager & Clevo Notebooks