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MObile GPU Wars Heating Up???

post #1 of 26
11/8/04 at 12:08pm
Thread Starter 
Take a look at the article...

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2268&p=1

looks like the GPU wars are getting into swing with Nvidia actually bringing something to the table... the article mentioned the M28 being out in a few weeks, anyone else thinking it's comming in a Dell iXPS2??? what cha all think?
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post #2 of 26
11/8/04 at 12:21pm
This ExtremeTech review also benches the upcoming M28 in 3DMark03/05 and various games:

nVidia Unveils the new GeForce Go 6800
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post #3 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:01am
Any possibility of the M28 being implemented on the present XPS? M28 is on PCI-E, so I guess that's a no?

Anyone know if Dell/ATI has any futher plans for newer video cards on the present XPS or the 9800 is the last one?
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post #4 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by devnull
Any possibility of the M28 being implemented on the present XPS? M28 is on PCI-E, so I guess that's a no?

Anyone know if Dell/ATI has any futher plans for newer video cards on the present XPS or the 9800 is the last one?
i dont think that they will make any more agp cards. the 9800 was the last one.
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post #5 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:13am
Thread Starter 
sadly the mr9800 is the last agp card, thus no more upgrades... we're stuck to waiting for better drivers and/or overclocking these chips since they seem to overclock well enough to reach benchmarks close to stock 6800go numbers
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post #6 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:17am
Ah, it's fine, I don't need to squeeze every drop of performance out of my notebook.

Any word on when PCI-E notebooks with M28s and such will hit the market?
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post #7 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:36am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devnull
Any word on when PCI-E notebooks with M28s and such will hit the market?
from reading various articles and other posts on the forum, it looks like we may hear a M28 equipped notebook in the next two weeks. many, as i am, are guessing it'll be the iXPS2 since dell has had new ati chips first as was the case with the mr9800

i'm admittedly jealous of these new systems (both the 6800go and the new m28) cuz they get twice the performance as this comp only three months old, but that's tech. only thing that makes the i9100 better for me was the cheap prices; roughly half of these new systems if not even cheaper
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post #8 of 26
11/9/04 at 3:25am
Oh wow, so the M28 performance is allegedly twice the performance of the 9800?
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post #9 of 26
11/9/04 at 4:04am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by devnull
Oh wow, so the M28 performance is allegedly twice the performance of the 9800?
note exactly as a real world M28 has yet to surface, but according to the test setups on various sites the 6800 go and the possible M28 perform close to twice as fast. they have 12 pipelines and faster memory. check out the articles...

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=Njg0
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2268
http://www20.tomshardware.com/mobile...108/index.html (shows 6800go benchmarks and MR9800 for comparison
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post #10 of 26
11/9/04 at 4:09am
now i wanna sell my i9100 for the next gen gpu's
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post #11 of 26
11/9/04 at 4:22am
Thread Starter 
i feel the same way speedy, but for the prices those companies are asking versus the price i paid, the performance jump isn't worth it. i'm probably going to wait and see if the upgradable graphics for end users really happens above one upgrade. one of those sites made a good point in that upgrade are really dependent on the systems thermal systems ability to keep new cards cool and power requirements. other than upgrading notebook graphics, i'm wanna see an AMD or intel 64 bit cpu and atleast 1066FSB to see some real jumps in performance. hopefully this i9100 and the MR9800 last a year keeping good playable framerates on the latest games then dual core may be out and 1 gig vid cards might be cheap and in laptops by then. yeah i know im ranting; sorry...

i don't buy computers that often since must have pc games don't come out that often. i'm a casual pc gamer in the sense i don't play too much and really just get hyped for major games like HL2, Doom 3, and command and conquer. since i have all three consoles to use up a lot of my gaming time as well, hopefully this MR9800 does a good job in the future.
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post #12 of 26
11/9/04 at 4:31am
sorry to be a troll... I pose a very good question

what do you think the chances of the m18 being a locked prerelease market test version of the m28? maybe the m18 can unlock to be a m28? Kinda strange they would make so many different cores when they could "control" a superior core into various configurations like the x800 and 6800 lines. Would save them $$$ too...

any engineers out there??? I know there is a way (read on a thread a while ago) with some machine code program to tap individual pipes in the gpu so you can see how many there are but i have no clue how to go about it..
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post #13 of 26
11/9/04 at 4:41am
Interesting quote from the HardOCP article:

Quote:
ATI does have their next-gen M28 part waiting in the wings. They did offer to get us a preview of their technology to compare with the 6800 the moment they learned we would presenting the Go 6800 to you today. Their launch will be later this month but I am unsure if the M28 is anywhere near being ready for retail sale like the GeForce Go 6800 is.

We did not want to cover the M28 as it just seemed as if ATI was trying to steal some of NVIDIA's thunder with a paper launch part.
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post #14 of 26
11/9/04 at 5:36am
Question here since I'm not tech savvy - If all I need my graphics card to do is play games, and I've got the 128mb 9700 and could upgrade to a 256, yet most games don't even require a 64mb, isn't there a point at which these 6800 Go and others are just going to be complete overkill if I'm just playing Call of Duty? I don't think the price would be worth that future compatibility if I swap computers out every couple years. Or am i totally wrong?
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post #15 of 26
11/9/04 at 5:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by keyessd
Question here since I'm not tech savvy - If all I need my graphics card to do is play games, and I've got the 128mb 9700 and could upgrade to a 256, yet most games don't even require a 64mb, isn't there a point at which these 6800 Go and others are just going to be complete overkill if I'm just playing Call of Duty? I don't think the price would be worth that future compatibility if I swap computers out every couple years. Or am i totally wrong?
A good rule of thumb is, if you're happy with your machine's current performance in the games you play, it's probably not a good idea to spend a lot of cash to upgrade.

Whenever you run into a future game you want to play that your system can't handle, then you should start shopping around to upgrade. Every 6 months to a year there will be some major development in performance. If you wait until you actually need that performance, then you'll be able to get even newer, faster tech. Or to look at in another way, by that time you'd be able to get today's latest and greatest for a cheaper price.
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post #16 of 26
11/9/04 at 2:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by whackamac
sorry to be a troll... I pose a very good question

what do you think the chances of the m18 being a locked prerelease market test version of the m28? maybe the m18 can unlock to be a m28? Kinda strange they would make so many different cores when they could "control" a superior core into various configurations like the x800 and 6800 lines. Would save them $$$ too...

any engineers out there??? I know there is a way (read on a thread a while ago) with some machine code program to tap individual pipes in the gpu so you can see how many there are but i have no clue how to go about it..
The chances the extra quads could be opened up to have the full 12 pipes are pretty good I would say. Only problem is the MR9800's are a relatively small market compared the desktop counterparts, so it might be a while before someone either comes up with a software mod (i.e. omega's 9800SE > 9800 pro driver) or a bios flash.
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post #17 of 26
11/9/04 at 3:25pm
i agree... maybe there is a brave engineer out there with a MR9800 that would like to play..?

With the tech knowledge that I do have, I can speculate that if we were able to turn the extra pipes on, the heat differential would be minimal while clocked to stock settings. This is based on my ability to stabily overclock my card 100mhz in both aspects (mem&core) I have NEVER seen a card with this much oc potential before.

I am getting ready to heatmod my 9800 and this would be a great thing to try if someone had the info how...
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post #18 of 26
11/9/04 at 5:11pm
I'd say we need to wait until we have some details on the new m28. Less see how the transistor counts line up before guessing whether the m18 and m28 are the same cores
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post #19 of 26
11/9/04 at 6:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogueone
I'd say we need to wait until we have some details on the new m28. Less see how the transistor counts line up before guessing whether the m18 and m28 are the same cores
No one reads the links anymore, eh?

This is from the article linked in the second post of the thread:

Quote:
ATI's R400 architecture has substantially fewer (29% less) transistors when matched against an NV40 architecture with the same number of pixel pipes--190 million for the GeForce Go 6800 versus about 135 million for ATI's upcoming M28.

Engine (MHz): 400*
Memory (MHz, effective): 400*
Transistor Count (millions): ~135 (TK)
Vertex Pipes: 6
Pixel Pipes: 12
Peak Pixel/Texel Fill Rate: 4.8Gpixels/sec*
Peak Memory Bandwidth: 25.6GB/sec*

*Depends upon implementation
I don't know how that compares to the Mobility 9800. I'll let someone else dig up those figures.
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post #20 of 26
11/9/04 at 8:34pm
You guys know that NVidia is going to have the fastest laptop video card, right? At nvidia's webiste, they have a GeForce 6800 Go Ultra that has 16 pipelines, just like it's desktop bro. That's the best of the best right there...16 pipelines is top notch performance for any videocard. I'd like to get my hands on it. Also- the current geforce 6800 go has only been tested in it's 275mhz flavor, and overclocked a bit in some tests. Note that NVidia has a model that runs at 400mhz. I'd expect it to beat ATI's M28 at that clock speed.
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