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Toshiba M3-S212TD : riffin-rich

post #1 of 11
4/24/05 at 3:25pm
Thread Starter 
Tecra M3 2.13GHz P4m, 2MB L2 Cache, 533MHz FSB
1024MB PC4200 DDR2 533MHz SDRAM (1024MBx1)
14.1"SXGA+ (1400x1050)
nVIDIA GeForce Go 6600TE 128MB dedicated SDRAM
Bluetooth
60GB 7200 RPM
2200 BG
4x DVD SuperMulti Drive
Windows XP Pro SP2
3 Year System Guard, Service Express, 2/3 year warranty extension
Advanced Port Replicator III
Prim 12 Cell Li-Ion High Capacity Battery Pack
Slim SelectBay Li-ion 2nd Battery Pack

Purchased at Toshiba Direct. $3,169.

System is about 2 weeks old … still trying to get it configured the way I like it … came pre-loaded with too much crap.

Relatively light, and rather thin.

Metal chassis is great, no creak/flex.

The 60 GB drive is much smaller than I anticipated … I’ve only got about 10GB free. I’m obsessive-compulsive about installing all components … I don’t do min/typical installs. But I wanted the 7200RPM drive, so 60GB was my only option at the time. My plan is to get a 100GB drive when they’re more available/affordable, then I’ll clone the 60 to the 100 and put the 60 in a slimselect bay cassette to use as a second drive.

Battery life was “about” 2 hours with the stock 6-cell battery installed ... I don't have the two extra batteries or port replicator yet (I'm living overseas and Toshiba won't ship to my APO box ... so they're sitting/waiting for me at my mother-in-law's house until I get back to the states in about 2 months). If I remember to pay close attention to the battery life, I’ll update this post with a more accurate number.

Screen is bright, and has no dead pixels. When unplugged, the monitor dims down quite a bit, but still adequately bright for me. I haven’t played around with power settings yet.

Notebook is very fast. Generates some heat when it’s plugged in. The fan is a little noisy, but it’s fine for me. The fan blows out the left side, right where I keep my drinks … good for coffee, but bad for a glass of water (it actually does warm it up when the system is plugged into external power).

No CD's, you must burn your own backup (8CDs … or 2 DVD’s if you have the DVD writer), and there is a backup partition. I personally think this is bullshit … I spent a lot of money … Toshiba ought to throw in the restore CDs/DVD’s. Oh well.

HORRIBLE MOUSE BUTTONS!!! Requires significant force, and not very comfortable … when I read Chapter’s post on this, I thought, “oh, come on now…” but holy cow, he was dead on. The springs have twice the force they ought to have, if not more than twice the force. I picked up a Logitech LX500 wireless mouse (very cool) EXCEPT, the M3 USB ports are on the right side of the notebook, at the front of the system. While this is bad for risking a bump to the USB mouse transceiver (which sticks out about 1.5” (or 4 cm), I suppose the blessing is that it’s very, very visible and I’m less inclined to break it off because I’ll hopefully remember to remove it. I’m so paranoid about this that I took a piece of paper and made a sleeve to wrap around it … then I used a yellow highlighter to make the sleeve stand out even more. On a dark desk, the contrast is good to keep (even me) from breaking it off. We’ll see over a couple of more months. ;-)

Touchpad and pointer … I thought they were fine once I adjusted the sensitivity.

Horrible speakers … yup! They’re tiny! I personally didn’t buy it to listen to music … I have a big desktop with a BIG speaker system if I want music.

I haven’t played with the Bluetooth yet …

I’m having a horrible time getting my 2200BG card to work … separate post under peer-to-peer support. Card is auto-detecting networks and has great signal strength, however, I just can’t get it to work with my wireless B router, or a friends wireless G router … I thought I had it all set correctly.

Like Chapter said, the MS Works and Office trial comes installed. I uninstalled it and then installed my copy of Office 2003, but, because of the uninstall, I couldn’t use the Office Update service. There is a lengthy fix, I also posted it in the peer-to-peer section.

This is my second Toshiba … the first one was a Satellite, Intel 486 DX2 – 50MHz … with a 12” active matrix monitor and it was indestructible! I have used about 5 different Dell Latitudes over the past 5 years or so. They’re a bit flimsy. Definitely heavy. Not nearly as solid as Toshiba, but they are a little cheaper. I’m much, much happier with my Toshiba than I am with my Dell at the office (I have an 800-series latitude). Anyway, the only other system I considered purchasing was the IBM … price didn’t scare me off … but rather, not knowing what would happen to the support since they sold to a Chinese maker, is what scared me off. I bummed out when I saw a new IBM T42, but, I’m still happy with this Toshiba. If it lasts like my last one did, I know I’ll have done well.

At this point in time, I have no regrets about my decision...

Good luck with your decision…
Rich
LL
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post #2 of 11
4/24/05 at 5:02pm
Nice machine. I wonder if there's any way to get into the mouse buttons and change the springs. In the Dell forums I saw a post by a guy who did tons of stuff like that.
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post #3 of 11
4/24/05 at 8:26pm
looks like a really nice machine.. looks expensive lol top of the line centrino, nice high resolution screen, bluetooth, tons and TONS of battery life and small size.. definetly a sexy high end notebook that has size/performance/batterylife/display
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post #4 of 11
4/26/05 at 12:00pm
M3 follow up

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So I have had the Tecra M3 for several weeks now.. here are some follow up comments...

The mouse button. Still not very good. It's part design/part manufacturing quality here.

The plastic "ridge" on the button that is horzontially placed on the button causes "pain" in the middle of your thumb! Think about it. The only design reason I can think of is that Toshiba wanted to provide feedback that your thumb is on the button and that your thumb won't "fall off".....

Then you have to consider that the button has VERY POOR feedback. Both with sound and the tactcile feddback that a proper button will give to your finger. So if your thumb is not on the ridge, 1/2 the time the button does not press. And the right-click button is worse! How can Toshiba allow a laptop out the door with two totally different buttons?

A Microsoft rep was visiting recently with his Tecra M2. His button was marginally better.

So, in all maybe it's just bad luck that I got a poorly made set of buttons.

Bluetooth.....NIGHTMARE. I have had Bluetoon on my laptops and PCs since 2002. Logitech, D-Link, Belkin, Dell laptop, Sony laptop, Apple, Sony Ericcson phone, Nokia phone, Motorola phone, various headsets Jabara, Nextlink, and Targus..etc. Toshibas proprietary Blutooth software is HORRIBLE! Really bad. Like 1/2 of the products dont show the full BT profiles. 1/2 wont even pair properly. I was able to pair and occassioanlly use a MACALLY mouse.

Intel 2200 B/G. I just got rid of all my 2.4 Ghz cordless phones in favor of Panasonic 5.8 Ghz. AND I STILL have to "repair" my Internet connection 1/2 the time. What gives. The reason I got the M3 is that it was a full Sonoma/Cenrtino solution, with full "PCI Express & Express Card" laptop. But Centrino is TOTALLY unreliable. Maybe it's that silly "Connection" manager thing that Toshiba has.

Again, the silly key placment of the "Delete, End, Insert, Windows" buttons is silly.

I love my RainDesign "ilap". It allows me to remain plugged into AC and stay cool. Too bad that the profile for AC keeps processor at 100%... which keeps that fan on 3/4 of the time. My friend thought it started to rain when he heard the fan on from across the room - it's loud.

And yes, I too uninstalled Office Trail to install Office Pro - then I too discovered that the update service does not work. THANKS MS for making life difficult for your cusotmers.

PS--- Toshiba should have Audi engineer the buttons. They are the masters on button feel/feedback/lighting etc.
http://www.audiworld.com/news/02/haptics/content.shtml


But I did spend $2,300 with a 3 year System Guard... so I try to put up with these things.... I really dont think that there is a better laptop out there at this very moment...
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post #5 of 11
4/26/05 at 2:55pm
Thread Starter 
Hi chapter. I completely understand where you're coming from on a couple of issues you have, but, I'm baffled by a couple as well. My post isn't meant to flame or discredit you/your post ... just provide a slightly different perspective (and in some cases, share complete agreement).

two totally different buttons? ... I don't understand ... the two at the front of the touchpad? My buttons are exactly the same and have the same feel ... just a bit too hard to press. The two between the touchpad and the spacebar are the same except for different sizes. Tension on them is easier than the tension on my front buttons, but, they're not raised enough to easily depress them. That said, my Dell Lattitude C840 in a docking station at the office has the pointing stick sitting too high ... it has permanently marked my screen.

Bluetooth.....NIGHTMARE. This is depressing ... I haven't played with BT yet, but, do intend to ... I'm not too excited about your experiences.

Intel 2200 B/G. Caused me some problems until, as I wrote in a separate post in the peer-to-peer section, I changed my device settings to put power management to "Maximum Power" when two days of troubleshooting were encapsulated in the joyous balloon popping-up an IP address. I've since set the power setting back to default/minimum power and it's worked fine ever since. I'm in Turkey for a couple of months left ... not 2.4GHz phones here that I'm aware of ... so I've not experienced any interference, but, that may change when I return to the states in 2 months.

...silly key placment of the "Delete, End, Insert, Windows" buttons is silly. I have to disagree. It's all preference, but I love them there, as opposed to where IBM puts them. This wasn't a factor in my purchase decision ... I thought I'd just have to get used to it ... but it's so natural (for me). Nothing against you or your preferences ;-) It might be worth checking to see if you can re-map keys. For what it's worth, my Ins, Del, and Alt keys are just to the right of my space bar, and to the right of those keys, are the up/down/left/right keys. Windows is top right (one to the left of right-most corner). Are yours the same?

I love my RainDesign "ilap". What is this??? I don't understand.

...friend thought it started to rain when he heard the fan on from across the room - it's loud. YES AGAIN! When plugged in, it's actually louder than my Thermaltake Volcano fan and Antec case with about 5 fans!

uninstalled Office Trail to install Office Pro ... did you read my fix on this? Posted in peer-to-peer section. Time-consuming but it worked!

Having a great deal of experience with Dells at work, I'm very, very happy with my Toshiba. The only question is whether or not I should have gone for an IBM ... perhaps for another $1K but I keep hearing that they're even more bullet-proof than the Toshiba's are. Those who have IBMs won't get anything else.

Take care,
Rich
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post #6 of 11
4/26/05 at 2:58pm
Thread Starter 

Replacing the mouse button springs ... ?

g00nter ... great idea! If there's a way to do it easily, I'd love to do this. Perhaps we should gang-up on Toshiba and ask for a mod kit to dramatically improve this computer. It's the most significant annoyance I have at this time. So much so, that I use a wireless mouse when I really don't need to ... it's called "avoidance." ;-)
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post #7 of 11
4/26/05 at 4:01pm

more. Tecra M3

Thanks! I am enjoying your posts. It's great to have someone else that has the shared experience of owning an M3.

My "silver" left and right click touchpad buttons, on the very edge of the laptop DO require differnt pressure, make a different sound, and feel different.

I am thinking, what if I glued a piece of felt or foam on top of the button? It would be softer, I would not have to feel that ridge, and it may make it easier to depress. BUT, it may leave a mark on the screen

I have an older IBM T30 at work, and a standard issue corded Microsoft keyboard for my desktop at home. I really think Toshiba made a mistake putting the insert key next to the spacebar, it's too easy to hit accidentially, which then has the user typing "over their text".

Thanks for posting fixes in the peer-to-peer section of Office Updates and the Wireless inability to "transmit". NOTE: The icon says: Connected to Buffalo, Excellent...but I dont seem to be able to send/receive packets. NOTE: It could be the Buffalo Router/Wireless Access Point. However I never had a problem with my Dell or IBM connecting to it.

Yes, Toshiba's Bluetooth implementation is unfortunate. I thought that Toshiba would have gotten it right. At the end of the day, it's really Microsoft's fault for taking so long to provide BT support in XP. At this point I would LOVE to have the infamous Widcomm? BT stack/drivers.

This is my laptop desk: http://www.raindesigninc.com/ilap.html The 14" Tecra M3 fits great on the 14# lapdesk. I definitly notice the fan coming on a lot less with the desk.

Has anyone done a complete restore, with the partition or CDs on the Tecra M3?

PS, all in all I am OK with the M3. Honestly, I did purchase a "custom order" Compaq V2000 at Circuit City so I could use up a gift card. I custom chose an Intel B/G, my Invoice said B/G the Chinese packing slip said B/G, but Windows and Compaq said it was built with Intel B. - Compaq/HP are cheating customers, it's a well known issue: www.dv1000forums.com
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post #8 of 11
4/26/05 at 4:36pm
Thanks. I'd definately try it, but I don't have one of these models ... yet! Maybe if you were all to start writing letters to Toshiba complaining about this, they would issue a fix, or let you have it fixed. Have you tried complaining to toshiba to see if they will do something? You have still had it for less than a month, right?

If you want to try it yourself, try and get a hold of toshrepairer (he visits these forums) and see if he can shed some light onto the button assembly (i.e. how to get at it, and what kind of springs they use). Also, now that I think about it, maybe the button assembly is actually "ok", but the buttons are a tad too wide casuing them to rub or stick agianst the chassis where they fit in. Can you comment on this?

As for the external mouse, I have always preferred them. I never could get used to trackpads or clit-sticks to use them fregularly for extended periods of time.

As far as the fan noise, in the power settings of my older tecra, I can adjust the fan for perfomance or battery even when on AC. Have you explored some of the properties or advanced tabs in the the power settings (if there area any) to see if these can be adjusted?

Another option would be to try undervolting the processor. There's a thread with a step-by-step tutorial in Notebook General. They assure that that it does not affect performance (speed) or hardware, yet maintains the cpu cooler and the fans off, thereby making it quieter and increasing battery life. Since it's all controlled via software and we're talking about reducing the voltage to the cpu (as opposed to increasing it), there's no warranty issues or real risk involved in damaging hardware, only stability issues if you turn it down too far. But since I don't have one of these and I haven't actually tried it for myself, I can't actually say much about it.
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post #9 of 11
4/27/05 at 3:59pm
I agree on the undervolting thing, it s really useful, I reduced cpu temp by 5 to 10C at full load, and my undervolting results are actually below average.
However I m using a D610 with integrated graphics so I wouldn t expect spectacular improvements with the M3. I do beleive it would be a nice improvement.
Please share your results if you try it.
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post #10 of 11
4/28/05 at 12:16am
Thread Starter 

What utility are you using to undervolt?

g00nter: All good questions. No ... I haven't written/called Toshiba yet. Too difficult given I'm overseas. Have you got a good customer service e-mail address readily available? I was concerned about the thought of undervolting the processor due to warranty issues and risk of damaging h/w; however, your note has interested me enough to at least take a look to see if it will work for me.

Chapter: That ilap thingy probably won't like a docking station too much, will it? Is there a way to quick-connect/quick-disconnect without interfering with a docking station? I have the Adv. Port Replicator III waiting for me when I get back to the states... Don't want to waste my money, but, the majority of time I plan to use it, it won't be in

Me venting: I'm pissed off today. I just learned the 1-year long school I'm heading to in 2 months is going to supply me with a notebook computer; I already had a desktop system so I didn't need to buy this notebook computer. F*^# Me! No ... it's not for sale ... it's probably just going to be a $3K couch-surfing system. We shall see soon enough. Take care, Rich
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post #11 of 11
8/25/05 at 4:09pm

Not impressed vs. My tecra m2

I have had a tecra m2 for personal use for about a year and a half and have been reasonably pleased with it.

Recently I obtained a new job and my company ordered me a brand new Tecra M3 to work with. I have been using the M3 at work for about a month and have not really enjoyed it (as much) as my M2.

I agree with numerous previous posts about the mouse/touchpad buttons being very hard to press and not very responsive. It is so annoying that I use a USB mouse so I dont have to deal with it anymore.

I also agree with several other posts in regards to fan noise. Compared to my tecra m2 the fan in the m3 runs more than twice as often! I mean when you have the fan turned to max performance the thing never, and I mean never, shuts off! I turned the performance down and the damn fan still runs a good 70% of the time. This was never an issue with my M2, the fan maybe ran 20% of the time at the most. I know there cant be that big of a heat difference from 1.5ghz(m2) and 1.73ghz(m3).

Also I am not nearly as impressed with my screen as I was on my m2. The screen seems dim and very prone to ghosting(smearing of images when moving) Not to say that my M2 was perfect because I can notice smearing on it ocasionally but it is much more of a problem on the M3.

Other than the gripes listed above the units are otherwise identical in layout/size/weight/performance.

Just wanted to get my gripes out about the M3. I am dissapointed in the steady decreasing quality in toshibas laptops and hope that they remedy the situation before they turn off too many of their customers.
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