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ZV6000 Review (and 9300 comparison)

post #1 of 47
Thread Starter 
Here is my early review of the ZV6000, and some comparisons to an Inspiron 9300 I returned. I will highlight the 9300 parts in blue to prevent confusion.


HP ZV6000:
15.4 in glossy brightview widescreen
Athlon 64 3200+ (2.0Ghz, 512kb cache) Socket 939 .13um NewCastle
chipset: Radeon RS480, southbridge: SB400, HP motherboard model 3085
ATI xpress 200m 128Mb dedicated graphics
1Gb (512x2) Nanya DDR pc2700 cl 2.5 ram
80Gb 5400rpm Seagate Momentus
DVD/CDRW combo drive
Broadcom wireless b/g with bluetooth
HP standard 1 year warranty

price: $914 (after $200 rebates)

for comparison:

Inspiron 9300:
LG WXGA+ 17in non-glossy, Pentium M 2.0, 256Mb Geforce 6800 Go, 1Gb DDR2, 60Gb 7200rpm HD, DVD/CDRW combo, Intel 2915 a/b/g, dell case, 3 yr complete care warranty
price: $1868 (after $130 rebates)


So first of all, I'm not saying these are two equivalent systems in all aspects. Gaming wise, the zv6000 can't compare to the i9300, but for other purposes, they are both good desktop replacement systems. If you are a gamer who plays all the latest fps at high detail, then the zv6000 is not for you.


SCREEN:

I returned my I9300 because the screen had silver whites and an overall metallic quality that made some tasks very annoying. Darker colors were very vivid and punchy though. It was a non-glare normal LCD, but the viewing angles were very bad, with noticeable changes by just small head movements. So going into this purchase, one of my biggest concerns was the LCD.

My zv6000 screen is the glossy brightview version. Overall, it is a very nice screen and I am satisfied. It gives a nice liquid-like effect. The colors seem to be not as "punchy" as the LG on the dell, but the whites are solid and overall good color representation. Glare is only a problem on dark backgrounds or on low brightness. I haven't had a lot of time with the brightview yet, so I wouldn't say yet that I prefer it over a good non-glossy display. But, if the dell had this screen, I wouldn't have returned it.

Neither screen arrived with dead pixels.

PERFORMANCE:

Well, both are fast. Since I don't have the 9300 to compare, I can't run any identical tests. Also, the HP came stock with even more bloatware than the dell, so I might not have even seen its true potential yet. But neither system is lacking in the processing area.

On the 9300, the 60Gb Hitachi Travelstar 7200rpm drive made slight ticking sounds even at idle. It wasn't enough to be a problem for me, but I notice the difference in noise now with the 5400 momentus.

The 80Gb 5400rpm Seagate Momentus in the zv6000 is silent by comparison with no ticking. You can hear some seeks if you listen for them, but still quiet. Some programs seem to take slightly longer to load, including the winxp boot. I don't think the rpm difference should be that noticeable between these sizes, so the extra bloatware might be to blame. I will have to see what happens after I reinstall the OS. Others have already reported dramatic improvements in performance after the fresh install on the zv6000.

I had thought this chipset was supposed to support dual channel, but all indications are that only single channel is functional. I don't know enough about the technology to know if this is something that can be changed with a bios update or the type of ram used.

The BIOS is one of the most basic I have ever seen, with hardly any options other than to add the extra shared 128Mb video memory, and almost no information about the current setup or devices. Hopefully, future updates will help out here.

SPEAKERS:

The predecessor to the ZV6000 (zv5000) had harmon kardon speakers, which were high quality according to other reviews and my own brief observations at a store. For the zv6000, HP decided to ditch the harmon kardons and added non-branded speakers. I think they are good quality, but not the best I have heard. Nothing I've heard so far from them has made me say "wow".

The dell 9300 had a subwoofer which helped out a lot and created a better sounding experience than the zv6000 with more bass and overall less mono-qualities. The 9300 wins here. If I had not heard the 9300 sound, I would probably think higher of the zv6000 speakers.

GPU:

No contest here. The 9300 has an NVidia 6800 Go with 256Mb memory. 3dmark05 score: 2970 if I remember correctly.

The zv6000 has an ATI Radeon Xpress 200m with 128Mb dedicated memory and an additional option for 128Mb more from the system memory configurable in the bios. Although this is technically not "integrated video" like the intel options, I think it was meant to compete in that arena. It is a much better performer than any integrated setup currently out there, and should run most existing games well. But the most demanding games will require you to lower the resolution or details to get decent frame rates. It is DX9 compatible, but its performance is below an x300, so don't buy this system for any bleeding edge gaming.
3dmark05 score: 673 / 3dmark03: 1435 / 3dmark01 SE: 5431


Heat, Fans, and Battery Usage:

The zv6000 is very cool for a desktop replacement. If you just surf the web or edit documents, it will stay very cool. The keyboard and touchpad area never get hot with casual use. The bottom of the laptop gets slightly warm, but using it on your lap would not be a problem whatsoever. It does get warmer on the bottom while you're charging the battery though. When you really stress the CPU, the exhaust heat will instantly rise, but it's still not very hot.

At idle, using mobilemeter, the cpu (at 1Ghz) shows 37 degrees, the hard drive shows 32 degrees.

At 100% CPU usage (2Ghz), mobilemeter showed 58 degrees. It took about 2 minutes of sustained 100% usage to make the fans ramp up higher. After returning to lower usage, the fans ramped down to base levels immediately.

I think the 9300 felt warmer to the touch, but the GPU was probably the culprit.

The fans of the zv6000 are not silent. If you are in a silent room, you will hear a low hum. It's not loud like a room fan, but it is noticeable. If you are in a room with a tv or music on, you won't notice it. The fans are also almost flush with where the laptop hits the ground, which seems like a design flaw to me.

The battery life is quite good for a desktop replacement with this power and a desktop processor. I either can't find the option to display estimated time left or it is not a feature, so I used a stopwatch. With casual use consisting of wired surfing the web, typing this review, and some streaming music on the 4th from the highest brightness level, I hit the following percentage of battery left at the times indicated:

with 8 cell battery:
1hr 7min - 50%
1hr 21min - 40%
1hr 34 min - 30%
1hr 47 min - 20%
2hr 1 min - 10%
2hr 7 min - 5% warning of impending doom

With the 12 cell option, you can probably expect an extra hour under casual use.

CONSTRUCTION:

I like the looks of the zv6000. It's not too flashy, but respectable. It also feels very solid and has an excellent keyboard with almost no flex. I am suspicious that some parts were skimped on to keep the price low, but so far I haven't found any except possibly the fan and speakers. It is a little larger and heavier than other 15.4 widescreen notebooks (~8 lbs), but for semi-mobile users like myself, it's not a problem. I wouldn't recommend it for heavy travelers.

The keyboard feels very similar, if not identical to the i9300 keyboard.

One RAM slot and the hard drive are user accessible with a screwdriver on the bottom of the laptop. The 2nd RAM slot is under the keyboard, which would require you to pop off a few panels and screws to disassemble it.

Click here for full specs of the HP ZV6000: HP site specs

My zv6000 also came with a 6in1 media card reader, IR port, firewire, bluetooth, and other options you can find listed on HPshopping.com, but since I haven't had a chance to use them, I won't discuss them here.

So for the price, I think it was an excellent deal. If it was over $1200, I would have went for other laptops with better gpus. But so far, I am happy with this purchase.

Ask any other questions you have, and I'll try to answer.
LL
post #2 of 47
Thread Starter 

Some benchmarks...

Everest tests:

Mem read: 2514 MB/s
Mem write: 1049 MB/s
Latency: 37.5 ns

Of these, the top 2 showed up in the middle of the built-in examples, below most of the dual channel and pc3200; The latency was the top scorer of all systems.

CPU-Z says:
Memory channels: single

PCMARK04: 3455 pcmarks

3DMARK05:
673 3dmarks
CPU score: 3414

3DMARK03:
1435 3dmarks
CPU score: 700
Fill Rate (Single-texturing): 349.8 MTexels/s
Fill Rate (Multi-texturing): 599.1 MTexels/s
Vertex Shader: 3.7 fps
Pixel Shader 2.0: 13.8 fps
Ragtroll: 7.0fps

3DMARK2001 SE:
5431 3dmarks
Fill Rate (Single-texturing): 402.0 MTexels/s
Fill Rate (Multi-texturing): 603.1 MTexels/s
High Polygon Count (1 light): 10.0 MTriangles/s
High Polygon Count (8 lights): 4.9 MTriangles/s
Environment Bump Mapping: 115.5 fps
DOT3 Bump Mapping: 47.6 fps
Vertex Shader: 68.3 fps
Pixel Shader: 69.5 fps
Advanced Pixel Shader: 43.6 fps
Point Sprites: 8.5 MSprites/s

AquaMark 3:
Score: 12,425
GFX: 1332
CPU: 9106


SANDRA:

CPU Arithmetic:
Drystone ALU: 9138 MIPS
Whetstone FPU: 3146 MFLOPS
Whetstone iSSE2: 4072 MFLOPS

CPU Multimedia:
Integer x4 aEMMX/aSSE: 18985 it/s
Float x4 iSSE2: 20420 it/s

File System Benchmark:
Drive Index: 34 MB/s
Buffered Read: 29 MB/s
Sequential Read: 38 MB/s
Random Read: 28 MB/s
Buffered Write: 81 MB/s
Sequential Write: 38 MB/s
Random Write: 27 MB/s
Average Access Time: 10 ms

Memory Bandwidth Benchmarks:
Ram Bandwidth Int Buffered iSSE2: 2504 MB/s
RAM Bandwidth Float Buffered iSSE2: 2495 MB/s

memory shown as 2.5-3-3-3 1 CMD

Cache & Memory Benchmarks:
Combined Index: 4225 MB/s
post #3 of 47
Gotta say nice comparison...Although unfair to the 9300 if you would have gotten it with the WUXGA BrightView, you would most definetly have kept it, being as it was the samsung monitor.

673 on the 3dMark05, was it running Solitaire 3d??? J/k but I did get a chuckle when I saw that,

congrats on the lappy always good to have another one on the boards
post #4 of 47
i think all the poo poo about the harmon kardon speakers is unwarranted. I think HK just lended their name to the same speakers that are in the unit now. Not sre why anyone would expect great sound out of these little jobs.
post #5 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by inteller
Not sre why anyone would expect great sound out of these little jobs.
Your use of the term "little jobs" amuses me.
Whatever they are, they aren't bad.

update: Maybe they are the same speakers, but they aren't "qualified" or tweaked for this relatively new chipset yet? Other people are saying that changing the drivers has made them sound even better.
post #6 of 47

3dmark scores

Scottman,
You didn't mention what amount of memory you were running for the 3d mark scores, but after looking at the options, it is most likely 128mb. Remember the GPU in the zv6000 is capable of 128 dedicated, with another 128 shared. I found that to turn this option on, you have to change the settings in the BIOS setup. I would be interested in updated scores that compares each of the settings. I am working on downloading the software, so I may give it a try.
post #7 of 47
Thread Starter 
That's a good idea, jeffghs. The above tests were for the default 128 dedicated only. I just reran them with the different options. Here are the new scores for 3dmark05:

128 dedicated + 128 shared
3dmark05: 671
cpu: 3473

128 dedicated (like before)
3dmark05: 670
cpu: 3455

128 shared only
3dmark05: 532
cpu: 2998

32 shared only
3dmark05: 489
cpu: 2681


So it looks like the added memory shows little if any improvement. I'm sure there are some situations where the extra memory might help, but the 3dmark05 tests don't seem to benefit by >128mb ram. Also, I would think that the extra overhead involved by having to access memory from 2 different heaps isn't an ideal setup.

Also notice that 128 or 32 (shared only) show a decrease as expected. But I think this would still outpace other integrated systems. With the dedicated onboard, no one should ever have a reason to do this, though.

But if you are considering not getting the onboard 128 option, the 32 mb results would probably be similar to how that system would perform. But I don't think there is any good reason not to get the 128Mb video upgrade, since it also adds the 6in1, IEEE 1394, Express Card/54, and quick launch buttons for a very low price (~$25).
post #8 of 47
Thanks, scottman. This is a good review, and it highlights well the important differences in the computers. Too many reviews just test the graphics subsystem. While admitted there are many gamers around, others do something else than gaming on the system, and then other qualities (such as noise and durability) are much more important. And your ATI system's performance is sufficient for older games, such as Warcraft III (although they don't like widescreen).
post #9 of 47
3D Mark01SE score of 5431??..

I get around 6000 with my 64MB Geforce4 440Go.
post #10 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by miner
3D Mark01SE score of 5431??..

I get around 6000 with my 64MB Geforce4 440Go.
Better drivers for DirectX 8?? I just run the test, I don't design these things.

Maybe future drivers will improve performance. These are still very early chipset drivers.
post #11 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottman
Better drivers for DirectX 8?? I just run the test, I don't design these things.

Maybe future drivers will improve performance. These are still very early chipset drivers.
Yes, I hope so...

I was'nt blaming you or anybody for the scores...I was just surprised that they werent any better than the results of the previous generation laptops. I got 5810 3dmarks on r3000z and so I was expecting around 7k - 9k with the upgraded processor,dual channel memory and the gpu with 128Mb dedi. memory and all.

I still think that it is a nice laptop for the value oriented casual gamer. For around $1000-$1500 only the gateway7426GX might be its competition. But support from HP is way better than gateway.

BTW thanks for the review
post #12 of 47
Awesome review. Thanks. I ordered an R4000 from OD last week with the same configuration. Any links to others who have reformatted to get rid of the bloatware? Are you aware of any driver or firmware upgrades that are necessary? Not sure why you're not getting dual channel support with S939 and 2 sticks of RAM. I'll look around the AMD forums to see if I can figure that one out.
post #13 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottman
Your use of the term "little jobs" amuses me.
Whatever they are, they aren't bad.

update: Maybe they are the same speakers, but they aren't "qualified" or tweaked for this relatively new chipset yet? Other people are saying that changing the drivers has made them sound even better.

If you REALLY have to have HK speakers get the xb2000 dock. They come on there.
post #14 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiratePast40
Awesome review. Thanks. I ordered an R4000 from OD last week with the same configuration. Any links to others who have reformatted to get rid of the bloatware? Are you aware of any driver or firmware upgrades that are necessary? Not sure why you're not getting dual channel support with S939 and 2 sticks of RAM. I'll look around the AMD forums to see if I can figure that one out.
I can't seem to find the link now and can't verify this, but I think the person said the winxp boot took almost half the time. A lot of that might just be norton security stuff. There aren't any "necessary" or worthwhile upgrades that I know of yet. The audio driver that other people tried and seem to like is the one that pops up when you run windows update.
post #15 of 47
Does the zv6000 come with ddr2700 ram? Can you replace it with a faster stick? Also, can you take some pics?

Thanks.

Im not really good at interperating the benchmarks so can someone translate? Can I play CS:S without any lagging at 1024*768 with all the bells and whistles down?

-jcll2002
post #16 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottman
I can't seem to find the link now and can't verify this, but I think the person said the winxp boot took almost half the time. A lot of that might just be norton security stuff. There aren't any "necessary" or worthwhile upgrades that I know of yet. The audio driver that other people tried and seem to like is the one that pops up when you run windows update.

it is just Norton....and believe you me when that thing expires the trial it is coming off. Total bloat.


I also suggest uninstalling java 5.0 and installing the 5.0 update 3 from Sun simply because ay time you update java it actually installs a whole new version.

Anything else that would be considered "bloatware" would be in the HP support suite.
post #17 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcll2002
Does the zv6000 come with ddr2700 ram? Can you replace it with a faster stick? Also, can you take some pics?

Thanks.

Im not really good at interperating the benchmarks so can someone translate? Can I play CS:S without any lagging at 1024*768 with all the bells and whistles down?

-jcll2002
Yes, HP ships it with pc2700 ddr333. All the specs I listed are what came stock with the system. pc3200 ddr400 will work, but be careful what you choose and keep the cl low. The memory controller is known to be picky.

I have heard others say doom 3 will only get around 10fps, but that's probably the most demanding game out right now. I think Half Life is more lenient. Anyone try it out yet?

I'm too lazy to take pics but here's a link to someone else's review with pics:
http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=2341
http://www.notebookreview.com/imageG...product=zv6000

Also, any zv5000 pics should be practically the same thing.
One thing that doesn't come through on most of the pictures are the blue led status and button lights which are a nice touch.
post #18 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by inteller
it is just Norton....and believe you me when that thing expires the trial it is coming off. Total bloat.

Anything else that would be considered "bloatware" would be in the HP support suite.
I finally got around to reformatting. The HP OS cd is a clean OS only. The drivers and other apps come on a separate DVD. I reinstalled all the drivers and some of the apps off the dvd, and it's good as new. I left off Norton, muvee, itunes, zone.com games, help and support center, hp enhancements. The bootup time is still not quite as fast as the 9300 2.0 w/7200rpm 60Gig, but before it would take about 1:30 to get to the desktop (single user auto load profile), and the background loading wouldn't be done until about 2:00. After the reformat and reinstall of Office and a few other apps, it takes about 1:00 to get to the desktop and there is hardly any background loading after that.
post #19 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottman
Yes, HP ships it with pc2700 ddr333. All the specs I listed are what came stock with the system. pc3200 ddr400 will work, but be careful what you choose and keep the cl low. The memory controller is known to be picky.

I have heard others say doom 3 will only get around 10fps, but that's probably the most demanding game out right now. I think Half Life is more lenient. Anyone try it out yet?

I'm too lazy to take pics but here's a link to someone else's review with pics:
http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=2341
http://www.notebookreview.com/imageG...product=zv6000

Also, any zv5000 pics should be practically the same thing.
One thing that doesn't come through on most of the pictures are the blue led status and button lights which are a nice touch.
Thanks for the post. Do you think CS:CZ will be able to run smoothly? Thats about the only game I care about. Also, what should I look for when choosing pc3200? Does it matter if I leave in a 256 stock stick and add in a gig stick at a different speed? Sorry for all the questions.

-jcll2002
post #20 of 47
Scottman, Quote: "CPU-Z says: Memory channels: single"

I'm puzzled about the single channel message you reported. Is that just something in CPU-Z or are you not actually getting dual channel support. Was this on battery or plugged in?
I just downloaded and ran CPU-Z on my desktop with a 3500+ and it shows dual channel.

On the laptop, could it be something in the bios configuration? Not sure if that's possible since the Northbridge controller is in the CPU for the S939's.
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