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My fraud alert story (warning: long)

post #1 of 24
5/17/05 at 12:31pm
Thread Starter 
So I am selling my laptop on Ebay, and I get 3 E-mails that want to buy the laptop for way more then the ‘Buy it Now Price’, all wanting to send money through BidPay, and all asking I send the laptop the same moment I get the confirmation E-mail from BidPay.

----E-mail from suremagayankeea18@keromail.com------------
"HELLO SELLER/ I AM A BUSINESS WOMAN BASED IN UK MY
CLIENT IS INTRESTED IN BUY IT NOW OF YOUR AUCTION TO
HIS NEW STORE ALADINO ELECTRONICKS&CO. IN WEST AFRICA
SO HE LIKE TO KNOW IF YOU HAVE UP TO 2 UNITS OF THIS
ITEM SO HIS MODE OF PAYMENT IS VIA CASHIER CHEQUE&
MONEY GRAMMS SO IF YOU ARE INTRESTED WITH THIS TERM
YOU CAN CALCULATE THE TOTAL COST OF BUY IT NOW +
SHIPPING COST VIA DHL EXPRESS YOU SHOULD ALSO EMAIL ME
YOUR FULL NAME CONTACT ADDRESS SO HE CAN ISSUE OUT THE
PAYMENT RIGHT AWAY. THANKS I AWAIT YOU SOONES"
------------------------------------------------------

--- E-mail from terrymor58th@yahoo.com --------
Hello Seller,

Thank you very much for your quick response am
grateful concerning my enquiry, is my daughter that
really need the laptop for her final project in her
school and am sure she likes your computer and been
my only child i always want to make her happy because I
lost her mother in sept 11 attack in United States and
ever since than she always be my wife and my only
daughter cause I love her so much.

My method of payment is by Western Union Bid Pay
which is a money order that will be issue on your name and
be sending to you at your contact address for
delivery.

Am ready to make your payment to you today with the
sum US$ 4000 Including the shipping cost because I
don’t want any delay concern the shipment and I want
the Laptop to be ship to me First Thing on Monday
Morning Unfailingly by [FedEx Express Delivery]
after you've receive my payment confirmation from Western
Union Bid Pay.

I can only buy the Laptop from you and make the
payment to you only right now only if you accept my
condition because I need the Laptop very urgent for
my daughter education.

If you've agreed to my condition to ship the Laptop
to me First Thing on Monday Morning upon my payment
confirmation notification which you’re going to be
notify via e-mail from Western Union Bid Pay.

Send me the following information for me to make
your payment to you and I want you to end the auction and
i want the Laptop to be ship out to me unfailingly by
Monday morning after you've received my payment
confirmation Via E-mail from Western Union Bid Pay.

Name===========
Address========
City===========
State==========
Zip Code=======
Country=======
Tel===========
Item Number===

kindly bear with my urgency and I have the Laptop
ship down to me upon my payment confirmation notification
which you're going to be notify immediately I have
made your payment to you with Western Union Bid Pay
and it's been confirmed by them.

I will make your payment to you right now with the
sum US$ 4000 and don’t forget I want the Laptop to be
ship down to me by [FedEx Express Delivery].

Here is my Shipping address below.

Receiver Name:George Morgan
Shipping Address:# 703 Georgie Court 279 Wessels
Street
City: Arcadia
State: Arcadia
Postal Code: 0083
Country: South Africa

Hope to hear back from you as soon as possible.

Thanks for your Quick Response
Therry Morgan


------------- Then he sends this.------------



Thank you very much am really grateful for you
having
the business with me and Congratulation I have made
your payment to you.

You will receive the confirmation of the payment in
your e-mail very shortly just keep on checking your
e-mail in case you've not receive the confirmation
yet.

NOTE after you've receive the confirmation of the
payment, your money order will be send to you at
your
contact address which you provided for me as your
payment information at your door step for delivery.

But am sure you must have received my payment
confirmation by now from Bid Pay and I hope you
still
don't forget our agreement cause am a man of my
words
and I hope you're also one.

I want the Package to be ship out to me first thing
on
Monday Morning as you have promised to do by [Fedex
Express Delivery] and get back to me with the
shipment
tracking number so I can check the Current status of
my shipment.

Send the package to my shipping address below and
get
back to me with the shipment tracking number.

Receiver Name: George Morgan.
Shipping Address: 703 Georgie Court 279 Wessels
Street
City: Arcadia
State: Pretoria
Postal Code: 0083
Country: South Africa

Kindly notify me when you receive my payment
confirmation from Western Union Bid Pay.

Hope to hear back from you soon.

Thanks for your Co-operation
Therry Morgan..

-----------------------

So I write back to him, and I say I will need to have the money in my bank account before I ship the laptop. Now, I don't know how he did this, but I get an E-mail from Western Union BidPay <Account@BidPay.com>. I just wonder how he got someone to send me an E-mail from BidPay, cause that is a legit domain. Anyway, here is the mail (full of spelling mistakes).


---- From: "Western Union BidPay" <Account@BidPay.com> -----
>
>
>
================================================================================== ======================================================================
>
================================================================================== ======================================================================
> THIS IS AN AUTOMATED MESSAGE, PLEASE
> DO NOT REPLY
>
================================================================================== ======================================================================
>
> *AUCTION PAYMENT NOTIFICATION*
>
> Western Union BidPay® Order Number: 2225861180
>
> Dear MJAVOR
>
> This is to notify you that Western Union BidPay®
> Accounts
> Payments has received an order placed by,THERRY
> MORGAN,
> the buyer of your auction item to have a Western
> Union BidPay® branded
> Money OrderSM sent to you as payment for the auction
> item.The order is
> currently being processed.
>
> The details of the transaction are stated below:
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *AUCTION DETAILS*
> AUCTION SITE :Ebay Inc.
> AUCTION ITEM :Sager P4 Laptop
> ITEM NUMBER :5196823965
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *FINANCIAL DETAILS*
> ------------------------------
> AUCTION AMOUNT: USD$4,000.00
> SHIPPING FEES : USD$40,00.00
> ------------------------------
> TOTAL : USD$4,040.00
> ------------------------------
>
> Once the order is processed successfully, you will
> receive another email from Western Union Bidpay®
> informing you that the order has been approved.
> The Money OrderSM will be delivered to your address
> below,Please verify that the name and address
> (As entered by the buyer)are correct:
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Seller Should Not ship until you recieve another
> email
> informing you that your money order has been
> APPROVED.
> and also seller must ship the item when you recieved
> the second confirmation email informed you that
> your
> money order has been APPROVED and in other not to
> delay
> your money order which will be ship out to you at
> your
> home address door step with the information provided
> to
> us by your buyer.
>
> seller must shipped the item to the buyer when the
> money order
> is approved and send the tracking number to our
> agent email
> addressaccthelps@accountant.com) DO NOT forget to
> include Order
> number,your full name and address.
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> PLEASE NOTE: This is only a notification informing
> you
> that the buyer has made payment to Western Union
> Bidpay®,
> The payment is currently being processed and is
> regarded
> as PENDING as it is still subject to APPROVAL after
> being
> successfully processed.Western Union Bidpay® hereby
> advises you NOT to ship the item until you have
> received another message from Western Union Bidpay®
> stating that your money order has been APPROVED,
> Please exercise some patience as the process usually
> takes 2 hours.
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Thank you for using Western Union BidPay® Accounts
> Payments.
> We look forward to serve your online auction payment
> needs
> better in the future.
>
> Western Union Bidpay Team
> BidPay Accounts Payments.
>
>
>
================================================================================== ======================================================================
> THIS IS AN AUTOMATED MESSAGE, PLEASE DO
> NOT REPLY
>
================================================================================== ======================================================================
-------------------

Then I get another E-mail from him

--- FromTherry Morgan <terrymor58th@yahoo.com ----

It was nice doing business with you anyway.I've
gotten
a mail from Western Union BidPay that your money
order
as been approved which means the second confirmation
of my payment you're expecting has been sent to you
and I am sure you must have received the approval
notification by now.

I want my Daughter package to be ship out to me
unfailingly today Monday as we've agreed and you
also
promised to do and get back to me as soon as
possible
with the shipment tracking number.

Hope to hear back from you soonest with the
shippment
tracking number so i can check the current status of
the shippment .
----------------------

Followed by another E-mail from what appears to be BidPay again.

-----> From: "Western Union BidPay" acct-helps@accountant.com ------------
>
>
>
>
================================================================================== =======================
> THIS IS AN AUTOMATED MESSAGE, PLEASE
> DO NOT REPLY
>
================================================================================== =======================
>
> *AUCTION PAYMENT NOTIFICATION*
>
> Western Union BidPay® Order Number: 2225861180
>
> Dear MJAVOR,
>
> A $4,040.00 money order for payment on eBay for item
> 5196823965 has been processed and will be sent out
> to
> your given address today.
>
> THERRY MORGAN has chosen to use Western Union BidPay
> for the speed of an online payment service from a
> name you can trust.
>
> First Class mail is typically delivered within 5-6
> business days, Western union BidPay assures that
> your
> Money Order will be delivered to you at your given
> address
> within the specified duration of days above.
>
> Thank you for using Western Union Bid Pay.
> We look forward to serving your online auction
> payment needs in the
> future.
>
>
>
> Western Union BidPay,
> Despatched Team.
> acct-helps@accountant.com
>
================================================================================== ===========================
> THIS IS AN AUTOMATED MESSAGE, PLEASE DO
> NOT REPLY
>
================================================================================== ===========================
> Thank you for using Western Union BidPay® Accounts
> Payments
>
================================================================================== =========================
>

Seems like BidPay thinks I should send the laptop before getting my money too. I let BidPay know, sent them all the information and asked if it was really legit. Of cousre, no response.

I also put my laptop on Ebay. It sold for the buy it now price. The guy E-mails me asking if we can do a third party secure transaction with a company I have never of heard of before. I tell him I will only use www.escrow.com and I never hear back from him. Its just sad there are so many scammers out there. These people should all be
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post #2 of 24
5/17/05 at 12:51pm
I get emails trying to pull the same type of scam all the time. It's more of an annoyance than anything.

Keep in mind that it is really easy to write a program that can send a spoofed email.

Thanks for alerting the members here that may not of seen this scam before!
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post #3 of 24
5/17/05 at 1:15pm
yeah i would get the same thing all the time when i would try selling my laptops on ebay. i don't use ebay anymore bc of this....you don't even know who is a legit buyer anymore, it seems like the scammers are everyone on there now. there was a guy here in notebookforums apple section that got taken on his inspiron 6000 by the same guys that are trying to scam you, so he's out $1200.

you know what you should do, send a box with a HOMEMADE laptop in it, like out of a cardboard box or something and write SAGER on the top of it....then say FU who got scammed now Beeeeehotch.... hahaha i've heard of people doing that to all those african scammers. also i didn't read everything but i guess his daughter's name is GEORGE? haha i also liked how he changed some of the address in the second address he wrote to you.

see what happens with these guys is......they EXPECT you to send the laptop as soon as they SAY you received an approval email, trying to trick you into thinking you got one, then you ship out the laptop monday morning.....payment is declined, but laptop is already gone and you're screwed. but yeah, i only WAIT until i know the payment is happily sitting in my bank account THEN i would send the laptop out, but the chances of that happening with this guy is not likely so send that HOMEMADE laptop that would be hilarious!
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post #4 of 24
5/17/05 at 1:21pm
total scam..clues that tip it off is shipping first for a laptop thats worth a couple thousand dollars before you actually receive the money and the mere fact that he mentioned so many times that he wanted the computer to ship as soon as the confirmation email arrived to you.

ebay is full of scammers, so becareful selling any high-end products since those types of products seem to attract a lot of people from "south africa", "nigeria", and god knows where....

Funny thing is how these scammers are using the September 11th attack to try to draw some sympathy from unknowing people to extort and steal money from them. I don't think it's okay to use an event that kill thousands of people (most of whom were innocent citizens likes ourselves) to try to scam people when in actuality it's nothing to mess around with...

with that said....ONE GENERAL RULE FOR SELLING ONLINE: Never ship your item out until you actually (physically) receive the money in your account. This includes money orders and cashiers check and what i like to do is actually cash them at my bank and get the cash in hand to make sure its not a fake money order or cashiers check....you can bever be too sure these days....

so Good Luck selling, and Beware!!! These scammers really get on my nerves cuz its so obvious that its a scam and unknowing people still get scammed.
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post #5 of 24
5/17/05 at 5:30pm
dude f*ck him. look at the western union guy's last email address and see if it matches with a real western union person's account.

i got taken for 2500 on a laptop when i was about 13 :-(
it took me like the whole summer of selling and stuff to come up with that $$. he told me that he sent the laptop, and the tracking # was working, then one day it said something like The package was returned to originating address because of a faulty postage stamp or some bull shit. all i know is that he called fedex or something and told them to send it back. the worst part is i was 13!!

o well, at least it was when i was young and not like 40 and having a family to take care of. now i dont ship to any one unless i have the cash, literally in my hand. if he sends something like paypal, ill go to the bank and take the funds that he sent and cash it out. anyway, remember dont ship untill you have the funds in your hand. and if monday rolls around and you still dont have them, tell him to go and buy it locally at a store or something.

peace
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post #6 of 24
5/17/05 at 5:44pm
man...i just put an auction up on ebay...within 2 hours some dude tryin to steal my money ended it...is there something i can do about this...?
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post #7 of 24
5/17/05 at 5:50pm
old news
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post #8 of 24
5/17/05 at 6:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by investinwaffles
o well, at least it was when i was young and not like 40 and having a family to take care of. now i dont ship to any one unless i have the cash, literally in my hand. if he sends something like paypal, ill go to the bank and take the funds that he sent and cash it out. anyway, remember dont ship untill you have the funds in your hand. and if monday rolls around and you still dont have them, tell him to go and buy it locally at a store or something.

peace
dont trust paypal too much either. They can always charge you back if they pay with a credit card. If you dont have money in your account, they'll charge to either your bank or credit card account. They will also freeze your bank account if you dont have a credit card tied to paypal.
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post #9 of 24
5/17/05 at 7:15pm
wow i can't believe people are still falling for that Africa scam on ebay. I have been buying selling and trading on various forums and ebay and here are some common rules to make your life a lot easier.


#1) Never use Western Union money transfer. Use paypal, money order, or check.

#2) don't ship international.

#3) Check all references and make sure they are legit. Heatware, ebay refs, and most forums have their own refferal threads. Check these throughly and verify that they are solid individuals.

#4) Use an escrow service if the value of the item is over $2,000.
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post #10 of 24
5/17/05 at 7:18pm

Usa

thats one reason to say in your add that you will only sell in the USA.
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post #11 of 24
5/17/05 at 8:42pm
I think you are being hasty about recommending not to ship internationally - we dont all live in the USA and theres a world beyond your borders !

I have bought loads of stuff on Ebay and NEVER had a prob with being outside of the USA.
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post #12 of 24
5/17/05 at 8:47pm
I got scammed too. Don't ship international and use ALWAYS Paypal.
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post #13 of 24
5/17/05 at 10:32pm
You guys think you hate the scammers... It's so much harder for a legit overseas person (myself being in Australia) trying to purchase a laptop hastle free. I have to go through a hell of a lot of emails trying to convince someone that i am not a scammer, and that I may be buying from overseas, but I can get it shipped to a friend in the US. They all think I have a parter in crime. *sigh*

Scammers aren't just bad for the sellers, they are bad for potential buyers too.

Also, with regard to your emails, I always right click on the email and go to properties to look at the header. Someone tried to scam money out of me about a week ago, offering a fake second chance. Here is what the header of his email looked like:

Return-Path: <secondchance@ebay.com>
Received: from web31313.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.198.108])
by imta07sl.mx.bigpond.com with SMTP
id <20050510073346.YIOS27516.imta07sl.mx.bigpond.com@web31313.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
for <scottryn@bigpond.net.au>; Tue, 10 May 2005 07:33:46 +0000
Received: (qmail 69183 invoked by uid 60001); 10 May 2005 07:33:44 -0000
Message-ID: <20050510073344.69181.qmail@web31313.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Received: from [172.182.116.248] by web31313.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 May 2005 00:33:44 PDT

Note: I've underlined the suspicious parts. Notice the return path is set as an eBay address (anyone can do this in an email), but it's actually sent via Yahoo using HTTP, so it would more-than-likely be Yahoo webmail service. I could be wrong in my way of checking emails, but it works for me.
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post #14 of 24
5/17/05 at 11:46pm
Thread Starter 
update: I got a very interesting respsonse from BidPay.
-------------
Hello mjavor,

Thank you for contacting BidPay. We are writing regarding your inquiry.

We apologize for any confusion. Currently BidPay.com does not allow for the purchase of auction items exceeding $1000 and does not allow the purchase of multiple money orders for such transactions. Any such purchase attempts will be canceled and your orders will not be processed. We appreciate your understanding.

If you have any questions or require additional information, please feel free to contact us by clicking on the "Contact Us" link via the web page at www.bidpay.com and we will be happy to assist you.

Sincerely,
bidpayservice@bidpay.com
www.BidPay.com
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post #15 of 24
5/17/05 at 11:48pm
by not shipping international i really mean shipping to countries that sound outrageous. Canada, England, and Austrailia I would have no problem shipping to if that person could show me some refferals. I have shipped to a soldier fighting in Iraq recently, and everything went super smooth.
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post #16 of 24
5/18/05 at 12:04am
to stop these scammers from ending your ebay auction early...just don't use the buy it now option, and only sell in the US and ship only when you get CASH in HAND (literally). Too may scammers out there these days and you would think this stuff gets old, but apparently some people selling on ebay have no idea....

just make sure you get your cash in hand and don't ship until you do...
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post #17 of 24
5/18/05 at 6:59am
the scammers bother me too....i still buy occasionally on ebay but not like i used to, there are just far to many theives out there. they runined what could have been a great place. as for the specific fraud, i would say good on you for being smart, lets hope that everyone else reads the e-mails and the thread, and is aware that there are more than just the one scammer exists...
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post #18 of 24
5/19/05 at 10:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Two Man Riot
wow i can't believe people are still falling for that Africa scam on ebay. I have been buying selling and trading on various forums and ebay and here are some common rules to make your life a lot easier.


#1) Never use Western Union money transfer. Use paypal, money order, or check.

#2) don't ship international.

#3) Check all references and make sure they are legit. Heatware, ebay refs, and most forums have their own refferal threads. Check these throughly and verify that they are solid individuals.

#4) Use an escrow service if the value of the item is over $2,000.
I'm not sure if this was mentioned:

Don't accept any personal checks. Scammers will pay over the amount and then ask you to return the difference. What will happen, the check will bounce and you're out of whatever you sent to them (goods & your money). Than, your bank is going to ask for their money back.

Found out when I was in the market for a motorcycle
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post #19 of 24
5/20/05 at 7:01am
Yeah, I have bought stuff from the USA several times, and had no probs.

Quote:
you know what you should do, send a box with a HOMEMADE laptop in it, like out of a cardboard box or something and write SAGER on the top of it....then say FU who got scammed now Beeeeehotch.... hahaha i've heard of people doing that to all those african scammers. also i didn't read everything but i guess his daughter's name is GEORGE? haha i also liked how he changed some of the address in the second address he wrote to you.
It would seem you read the story of the P-P-Powerbook!! ( http://www.p-p-p-powerbook.com/ if your interested!) What a joke! The guy did a scam like the one at the start of the thread, except used a fake escrow site, so the seller made the guy pay a stack of money for a fake laptop!!!
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post #20 of 24
5/22/05 at 12:39am
This issue cuts both ways. Both sellers and buyers.
If you are buying: look at the way the ad is written. If they really have the item they will be able to describe it properly. Also look at the photos. Do they look like they took them. Ask for a photo taken in an unusual angle or with a specific item. That way you know at least they have the item. Even ask for a copy of their original purchase order. Be aware that Paypal does not refund your money unless the seller has a Shield next to their name. I got caught out on this buying some disk drives from ndfrancis9 in the UK. They don't tell you you are not covered. Only got ebay's std refund. Be warned.

If you are selling then as others have suggested wait until you have cleared funds in the bank. Genuine buyers have no qualms about this. Particularly if you can provide them with the items like photos and proof of purchase.
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