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4780? - Page 2

post #21 of 79
Here is the answer. Dual channel would be a lot better. RAM is so important. The faster data moves in and out of RAM, the better it is for games. You guys already know that. The real question you want the answer to, is why they didn't decide to include dual channel?
post #22 of 79
Yeah Interloper, I think you're right. Im just bumping my head at the wall since I've been waiting around for the perfect laptop for months, and when finally the 4780 is announced they didnt include the dual channel RAM, and therefore hitting us gamers hard /sigh.


Cheers.
post #23 of 79
Thread Starter 
good to know about the dual channel ram..

--JR
post #24 of 79
Quote:
Originally posted by Interloper
Here is the answer. Dual channel would be a lot better. RAM is so important. The faster data moves in and out of RAM, the better it is for games. You guys already know that. The real question you want the answer to, is why they didn't decide to include dual channel?
I totally disagree, for most games, most of the time dual channel mem will make no difference at all, and on these notesbooks by far the most significant bottleneck will be the video card, not the system memory bandwidth, especially in upcoming, shader intensive games like HL2. Dual channel memory won't make the slightest bit of difference for HL2.
post #25 of 79
Great, now Im totally messed up on my purchasing decision.

Any other opinion regarding dual RAM and gaming?



Cheers.
post #26 of 79
Quote:
Originally posted by WTB
Great, now Im totally messed up on my purchasing decision.

Any other opinion regarding dual RAM and gaming?

Cheers.
The faster the RAM, the faster the PC. Dual channel = faster.

But... (there's always a but... )

Games tend to move large contiguous blocks (or "chunks," if you prefer) of information in an and out of memory at a time. This large-block movement will not benefit as much as more random access.

Office applications (like Word and Excel) typically move small, random blocks of information in and out memory, so they will see a larger speed increase.

Disclaimer: This is my understading of how CAS, RAS to CAS, etc. works.

It takes a long time to load ("fire-up") a row of transistors, but comparatively little time to stream that row across the bus. So, if you can load load on a rise, and send on a fall, small, random memory accesses will benefit, since this is repeated over and over and over again. But, loading on a rise, and sending on a fall, with no more loads for a while, will not benefit as much.
(e.g.: one time doesn't benefit as much as multiple times.)

I hope this helps!
post #27 of 79
When I built my desktop system I was curious and tested the difference between dual channel and single channel. I couldn't notice a difference. 3dmark tests where almost the same.

Then again this is on a nForce chipset. I hear dual channel on an Intel chipset it better.. *shrug*

Either way, I'll give up a couple FPS and order a 4780 over a 5680/8890.

4760 & 4780 = Sexy
8890 & 5689 = Ugly



The first person here to get a 4780 will be Adam@PCTorque. I'm sure he'll do a review and we'll see the numbers.
post #28 of 79
Quote:
Originally posted by sp0rk
When I built my desktop system I was curious and tested the difference between dual channel and single channel. I couldn't notice a difference. 3dmark tests where almost the same.

Then again this is on a nForce chipset. I hear dual channel on an Intel chipset it better.. *shrug*
Right. Large sequential memory reads should go about the same...

Did you test with some sort of automated Office testing routine? I would be interested in seeing how much difference is noted there.
post #29 of 79
If you have the $200 for the CPU upgrade, I'd go for it. That's a lot harder to upgrade later. RAM and HDs are pretty easy to upgrade later and the prices are coming down all that time.

If you go shy on the ram, then make sure you get a single stick of 512 rather than two sticks of 256. That way when you upgrade, its just adding another stick instead of tossing what you have and starting from 0.

I'd go with the 7200 rpm drive in that size. Again, the cost differential ($123) isn't all that great so you might as well go for the gold now and enjoy it rather than sit there wishing. Fact is, given a choice between two sticks of 512 RAM and the slower drive vs one stick of 512 RAM and the faster drive, I'd go with less RAM and a faster drive. Its just easier to add RAM as well as its more likely the price of the RAM is going to drop than the price of the drive plus with the RAM, you are adding while upgrading the drive would be back to tossing what you have and starting from 0.

Welcome to SAGER, hope your machine makes your dreams.
post #30 of 79
Quote:
Originally posted by LeFisch050
The faster the RAM, the faster the PC. Dual channel = faster.

But... (there's always a but... )

Games tend to move large contiguous blocks (or "chunks," if you prefer) of information in an and out of memory at a time. This large-block movement will not benefit as much as more random access.

Office applications (like Word and Excel) typically move small, random blocks of information in and out memory, so they will see a larger speed increase.

Disclaimer: This is my understading of how CAS, RAS to CAS, etc. works.

It takes a long time to load ("fire-up") a row of transistors, but comparatively little time to stream that row across the bus. So, if you can load load on a rise, and send on a fall, small, random memory accesses will benefit, since this is repeated over and over and over again. But, loading on a rise, and sending on a fall, with no more loads for a while, will not benefit as much.
(e.g.: one time doesn't benefit as much as multiple times.)

I hope this helps!
Thanks for the answer mate. Unfortunately Im a total tard when it comes to tech stuff, so I'll dumb down my reply: so, basically, you're saying that large, complicate graph applications (like games) will not suffer much from single channel RAM, while microsoft office programs will greaterly benefit from the dual channel?

If so, whats the point? microsoft oddice applications already run fast as hell on today's computers, dont they?

Sorry if Im sounding stupid. Like I said, Im iliterate about tech issues. I only use my computers for internet, microsoft office programs, and games.



Cheers.
post #31 of 79
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by MARQUISDARQUIS
If you have the $200 for the CPU upgrade, I'd go for it. That's a lot harder to upgrade later. RAM and HDs are pretty easy to upgrade later and the prices are coming down all that time.

That's what I'm planning on doing, getting the fastest CPU initially so I don't have to upgrade later.

oh and PinkFloydFan.. you better be posting some pics when you get your 4780! haha i know you will.

Thanks for the ideas guys,

--JR
post #32 of 79
Hypersonic-pc is accepting orders on their 4780, 5 weeks turnaround time.....I configured one to be $3793
post #33 of 79
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by sandoon
Hypersonic-pc is accepting orders on their 4780, 5 weeks turnaround time.....I configured one to be $3793
5 week turnaround time my ass... it's so expensive too! I configured one and it was $3790 with custom paint/mouse, 3.2 GHZ CPU, 1GB ram through 2 dimms, 60GB 7200RPM HDD, 6-1 card reader, internal wireless and no OS.

I bet it'll be in around $2500-3000 for a configuration like this from PCTorque (that's what the price differential was with the 4760's for equal setups)

But even when PCTorque announces that they're ready I bet it'll be a while to start getting them out.. that's the only reason I think the Hypersonic 5 weeks turnaround is BS.. feel to think what you want though.

--JR
post #34 of 79
5 weeks seems about right. 2-3 weeks until they are supposed to be out. Another 1-2 weeks for build/deliver.

Way too expensive tho. Plus the specs they have for the 4780 don't match PCTorque.
post #35 of 79
what do you mean the specs don't match???
post #36 of 79
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by sandoon
what do you mean the specs don't match???
that's what I was thinking.. the 4780 is supposed to have a fixed tv tuner and 6-1 card reader as well as sub.. this has the option for either the card reader or the sub as well as an option for the tv tuner. All the other specs look pretty similar though.

--JR
post #37 of 79
Quote:
Originally posted by WTB
Thanks for the answer mate. Unfortunately Im a total tard when it comes to tech stuff, so I'll dumb down my reply: so, basically, you're saying that large, complicate graph applications (like games) will not suffer much from single channel RAM, while microsoft office programs will greaterly benefit from the dual channel?

If so, whats the point? microsoft oddice applications already run fast as hell on today's computers, dont they?

Sorry if Im sounding stupid. Like I said, Im iliterate about tech issues. I only use my computers for internet, microsoft office programs, and games.

Cheers.
Seems like you got it just fine!

You will see some speed increase with games, but as someone here already mentioned, it will be very slight. Yeah, Office apps will benefit the most - and yeah, they probably don't need it quite so much... Aren't computers fun??? Actually, the Internet would probably benefit quite a bit as well, since the browser is a very memory-intensive program.

In three years, it won't matter - the PC will be S-L-O-W!
post #38 of 79
I think it is time for Adam to ring on the 4780 release question. He's been relatively quiet regarding this. We know you know, that you know, that we know that you know when the 4780 is going to be ready for pricing so why don't you just let us know. Hehe. It comes when it comes.
post #39 of 79
lol, thats quite the maze of words you strung there
post #40 of 79
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by Darkpete17
lol, thats quite the maze of words you strung there
maze indeed but a good point..

--JR
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