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Another design flaw with 9880  

post #1 of 38
6/24/05 at 2:39am
Thread Starter 
Hello-

Well, I've found yet another significant design flaw with my 9880.

I went to plug in the power connector, and instead drew a huge blue spark. Because Clevo provides no little "door" to cover the ports like every other laptop manufacturer I've seen, it leaves the female studs out in the open - directly next to the female power plug. Therefore, when you've bumbling around back there trying to plug in the MALE power plug, you have a very good chance of accidentally "plugging" it into one of those studs, thereby shorting out all four pins and producing a big spark. Not something good for the power supply.

Fortunately, everything seems to be working fine so far afterwards, but if this happens to more people, Clevo should offer port protectors.

TM
post #2 of 38
6/24/05 at 3:58am
Would plugging it into the wall outlet after it is plugged into the laptop prevent this?
post #3 of 38
6/24/05 at 4:03am
Thread Starter 
I suppose, but I'm sure the capacitors inside the power supply hold a charge for quite a while.

Either way, this is an unacceptable design flaw. It'd be like a sweat band manufacturer making a wrist sweat band with a razor blade in it - it's just a disaster waiting to happen.
post #4 of 38
6/24/05 at 10:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadiJeff
Would plugging it into the wall outlet after it is plugged into the laptop prevent this?


or just gtet the caps your self...theyre like 10 cents
post #5 of 38
6/24/05 at 3:18pm
Thread Starter 
Who sells them?
post #6 of 38
6/24/05 at 3:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMatrix
Hello-

Well, I've found yet another significant design flaw with my 9880.

I went to plug in the power connector, and instead drew a huge blue spark. Because Clevo provides no little "door" to cover the ports like every other laptop manufacturer I've seen, it leaves the female studs out in the open - directly next to the female power plug. Therefore, when you've bumbling around back there trying to plug in the MALE power plug, you have a very good chance of accidentally "plugging" it into one of those studs, thereby shorting out all four pins and producing a big spark. Not something good for the power supply.

Fortunately, everything seems to be working fine so far afterwards, but if this happens to more people, and Clevo refuses to do anything about it (such as starting to use modern barrel connectors, or a protective cover for the ports), that could be grounds for a class action lawsuit.

TM
Please do not get the phrase "design flaw" mixed up with "improper use". For those of you following along in the book page 3-2 of your users manual. It clearly states the order that you should plug things into your laptop, deviation from these instructions can cause issues such as the one you described. I am sure there is a reason for the design, since I am not an engineer I can't give you their reasoning. From a guess and a long time follower of these laptops I am going to say it is a sturdy design, the previous connection design used in the 56xx series was more prone to the connector on the end going bad, this doesn't seem to be the case with this design. In the event that you are completely dissatisfied with this "significant design flaw" I would recommend returning your notebook under Sager's 30 day policy and getting another one that is more to your liking.
LL
post #7 of 38
6/24/05 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke@PCTorque
Please do not get the phrase "design flaw" mixed up with "improper use". For those of you following along in the book page 3-2 of your users manual. It clearly states the order that you should plug things into your laptop, deviation from these instructions can cause issues such as the one you described. I am sure there is a reason for the design, since I am not an engineer I can't give you their reasoning. From a guess and a long time follower of these laptops I am going to say it is a sturdy design, the previous connection design used in the 56xx series was more prone to the connector on the end going bad, this doesn't seem to be the case with this design. In the event that you are completely dissatisfied with this "significant design flaw" I would recommend returning your notebook under Sager's 30 day policy and getting another one that is more to your liking.
Have to concur with Luke, who more eloquently stated the obvious:

RTFM.
post #8 of 38
6/24/05 at 4:10pm
Why are the simplest situations, dragged out and made into huge scenarios?

I eitehr have the only 9880 that gives no problems whatsoever....or im not sitting theyre nitpicking at things like: why does it say windows xp?
Why is the laptop dark gray?

Or the one i really laughed at: Why doesnt my s video cable provide sound?

Matter of fact only issue ive had is with bf2, it kept shutting down my wireless card. So i just opened all ports in my router for the game.
Now i can shoot enemied down without being disconnected abruptly. This is not even a hardware problem, the game is just so greedy with resources from my opinion.
post #9 of 38
6/24/05 at 4:19pm
Thread Starter 
Having a stud (although technically it's not a stud) that close to something where high current pins are going to be, shows poor design and attention to detail.

You can see where the spark arced.





I would hardly call that "improper use." And on the subject of laptops/technology, one shouldn't have to "RTFM" to avoid potentially damaging sparks during normal use - especially when corners have been cut that exacerbate such conditions.

I'm sure I speak for the majority when I say I don't use my serial port or parallel port frequently - so why does Sager/Clevo leave them completely uncovered; exposed to dirt and dust?

I'll even buy covers myself if I could find a place that stocked them. Anyone know of any?
post #10 of 38
6/24/05 at 4:25pm
Thread Starter 
ambitwogunz,

It won't be dragged out any further. I'm just worried I damaged my power supply because they didn't pay enough attention to the obvious permutations of how their product would be used under normal situations.

A ~$3,000 laptop, and they can't throw in a few little plastic port covers?

Edit:
-----------------
I do apologize for my initial post - I had been up about 30 hours, and was a bit annoyed when I thought I might have damaged something accidentally. Now that I've had a chance to calm down, I've since removed the "harsh" parts from that message.
post #11 of 38
6/24/05 at 4:37pm
I once had big trouble with my 8890 because of this. I had to RMA and repair it because something was shorted. Needless to say, for someone living in canada, shipping prices are hefty, not to mention the inconvenience of having to do all my schoolwork for about a week without my computer.

I hope Sager comes up with a better design for their next notebook.
post #12 of 38
6/24/05 at 5:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMatrix
I would hardly call that "improper use." And on the subject of laptops/technology, one shouldn't have to "RTFM" to avoid potentially damaging sparks during normal use - especially when corners have been cut that exacerbate such conditions.
The manuals of nearly all Sager models (at the very least, all current models) are quite explicit on the order in which the power should be connected (for those ancient NP8890 users following along, my manual states the order on page 2-2, "Power Sources").

Am curious as to what would constitute "improper use" if the manual makes a point to plainly indicate the proper usage.
post #13 of 38
6/24/05 at 5:51pm
Thread Starter 
Along those lines, guard rails on bridges should be removed since road guidelines clearly indicate you must stay within the lines at all times - if you fall off the bridge, well then that doesn't matter, because you had no business being out of your lane in the first place.

Same goes for any sort of crash protection on a vehicle - I'm sure it says somewhere in a car manual to avoid impact with a tractor trailer at 50 MPH, but contrary to popular belief, accidents DO happen, and it's a manufacturer's job to eliminate the obvious problems and try to make the end product more user-friendly/safe.

I could understand if this required extraordinary circumstances to duplicate, but it doesn't. Am I going to return my 9880 because of it? No, of course not. But that doesn't change the fact that Clevo got lazy. It reminds me of a Family Guy rerun I saw a few nights ago - Brian was getting acupuncture, and the doctor who couldn't read had stored the "Poison tipped needles" next to the "Sterile needles". It's just an accident waiting to happen that could very easily have been alleviated.
post #14 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMatrix
... but contrary to popular belief, accidents DO happen...
As I deal with risk and contingencies on a hourly basis as my livelihood, I can confidently say it is unequivocally impossible to plan for every end-user contingency, and that manufacturers have to assume a reasonable amount of end-user common sense, which certainly includes the ability to read and understand the included documentation.

Will again have to agree with Luke - if you are unsatisfied with (or unable to properly operate) the machine you've purchased, by all means return it in favor of another that may satisfy you more. Not every machine is suited for every end-user (I've simply lost count of how many colleagues remark about the weight of my machine, and how they couldn't fathom toting it around the city).

Am glad to see the retraction of a few of the more inflammatory statements, however. Am certain we can all empathize with the initial reaction after making a mistake of such magnitude.
post #15 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:17pm
The fact of the matter is that the connection is a common design, just as barrel connections are common. I however prefer this connection as I broke my comcrap computers barrel connection (actually 2 of them) because they are weak. I have yet to break this type of connection. So there are plusses and minuses to most decisions, obvioulsy sager decided to the plusses of this configuration outweighed the minuses.
post #16 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambitwogunz


or just gtet the caps your self...theyre like 10 cents

Because i paid 3100+$ for a laptop, i shouldnt have to pay an additional for it
post #17 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:21pm
I found a design flaw with common house hold forks.. If you stick one in your eye (you know, to scratch an itch or something similar), you can, indeed damage your eyeball, significantly!

(Sorry Matrix, the masses are correct... The manufacturers of the world can't be expected to protect someone that is not willing to follow thier instructions.)
post #18 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMatrix
Having a stud (although technically it's not a stud) that close to something where high current pins are going to be, shows poor design and attention to detail.

You can see where the spark arced.





I would hardly call that "improper use." And on the subject of laptops/technology, one shouldn't have to "RTFM" to avoid potentially damaging sparks during normal use - especially when corners have been cut that exacerbate such conditions.

I'm sure I speak for the majority when I say I don't use my serial port or parallel port frequently - so why does Sager/Clevo leave them completely uncovered; exposed to dirt and dust?

I'll even buy covers myself if I could find a place that stocked them. Anyone know of any?
uhh, microcenter, compusa and most pc repair shops. Id try the pc repair shop first since they have em laying around and will probably charge you nothing
post #19 of 38
6/24/05 at 6:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by HellHawk
I found a design flaw with common house hold forks.. If you stick one in your eye (you know, to scratch an itch or something similar), you can, indeed damage your eyeball, significantly!

(Sorry Matrix, the masses are correct... The manufacturers of the world can't be expected to protect someone that is not willing to follow thier instructions.)
that sh1t was funny!

i agree with both you and actuarytm, if youre not aware and considerate of what and how you plug a power adapter/regulator to its socket ...then you have no buisness with a machine of this caliber. Or any machine for that matter. Anything can get burnt, thats why such items are provided to consumers with manuals stating cautionary procedures/how-to's.

To be honest i pull it out and plug it back in without looking. I perform such task without the fear of frying internal components due to shortages from +/- pin contact.
post #20 of 38
6/24/05 at 7:27pm
Thread Starter 
I am no longer debating barrel vs. 4 pin connectors. I'm arguing the foolishness of placing a round metallic object within .5" of the intended location of a male plug, specifically on the back. It's simply an accident waiting to happen while fumbling around, trying to plug in a high current, open pinned, connector.

There's a big difference between "every end-user contingency" and smoking while playing with gas - sure you *might* not get burned, but it's certainly not a good idea. And that's what a good designer's job is to do - plan for highly likely contingencies that would go on during the NORMAL (but not to-the-letter) operation of the device, and remove them.
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