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A notebook battery guide - Page 3

post #41 of 117
5/13/06 at 11:17am
When storing - store it in a cool place at 40% charge rate. Never store full (to high discharge) - Lower and you face the risk of complete uncharge and breaking the battery.

After some years even with best care any battery will be broken - therefore you can't buy batteries for the future thinking to replace it once the one in use doesn't hold much capacity anymore.
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post #42 of 117
5/14/06 at 11:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpheus
Hey peeps... Great article! Only one thing that didn't become clear for me: What's best when using it mostly as a DTR?

1) Always use it with the charger connected (with the possible problems related with the battery being @ high temps)

or

2) Always charge it to 100%, use it without the charger connected, and when battery is close to be empty, recharge it (consuming charging cycles)


Thanks!!!
I'd just remove the battery at about 40% charge and store it in a cool dark cupboard or Notebook bag.

If you're planning to run the NB as a desktop replacement just run it off the mains without the battery in it.

Use the battery when you need to be mobile!

MY QUESTION,
Is there a way of leaving the battery in the NB all the time and disabling the charge funktion? Or even leaving the battery in but disabeling it completely in windows?

That way the battery is always attached but not charged. I could choose myself if it should charge or not?

Maybe by deactivating the "Microsoft ACPI-....battery" in hardware manager?

My 17" Asus A7D (Z83D) has the battery right up in front without any heat souces nearby so loss of life due to heat is negligable. I use the A7D as a desktop replacement and its on 24/7 around the clock. I only ever need the battery once a month if I should take the NB out any where...
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post #43 of 117
5/14/06 at 12:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by amd-xile
For those with AMD processors, some extra degree of power management is available by downloading the latest processor drivers from the AMD website (link provided below). Oftentimes (as was the case with mine), the new laptop will have the WinXP processor driver installed--which doesn't have PowerNow! support.

PowerNow! allows automatic powering-down of devices not in use (so you don't have to manually enable/disable them thru the Control Panel as recommended in the article above, unless you want to, but the effect is [pretty much] the same). Supposedly it also helps with processor throttling. Unfortunately, it works partly thru XP's Power Management window, so it doesn't bypass OS control of power management, but augments it. I recommend it, though, to anyone with a Mobile AMD Athlon64.

Once installed, you can go to the Control Panel--> Device Manager & open the Properties window for the devices you want to micro-manage. In the Properties window, you will now have a "Power Management" tab for certain devices (including USB hubs, PCMCIA card slots, WiFi, etc.). The default setting is to power-off each device when not in use (there is a check-box at the bottom of the Power Management tab in the window, which you can check or un-check).

Example: Since I never use my PCMCIA slot, I manually disable it (you can see that in the first screenshot), rather than let PowerNow! choose when to turn it off. But I _occasionally_ use my Ethernet port so I let PowerNow! automatically manage those by right-clicking on the Ethernet controller in the Device Manager, then clicking on the Power Management tab, & checking the box that says "Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power."





To install the new processor driver, simply download the .exe file & run it. I think the .exe file might be the same for all processors, but I'm not sure, so, to be safe, I'll give separate links for each processor. Somewhere in those pages you can also find a 'Cool & Quiet' driver for Linux, as well, but I don't think it works for Mobile chips yet.

Links (scroll part-way down & find Processor Driver 1.2.2.1 or 1.2.2.2 [1.2.2.1 is for 32-bit WinXP, 1.2.2.2 is for 64-bit WinXP]):
Mobile AMD Athlon64
Mobile AMD Sempron (32-bit)
Opteron 64
(non-mobile) Athlon64
AMD Turion 64
Dual Core Athlon 64

Note: once installed, the WinXP (32-bit) Device Manager will say that the Processor Driver revision is 1.2.2.0, but in fact it is the updated 1.2.2.1 [don't be put off by it]. Bon Apetit!~
I've installed the Turion64 drivers from AMD. But except for the netwerk card, it's not possible to throttle down or turn off any other devices in hardware manager. Only way is to deactivate manually.
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post #44 of 117
5/15/06 at 5:16pm
My name is Patrick Allmond, and I own www.batteryfuel.com. We sell laptop batteries and power supplies of all sorts, and this is some of the best information I have seen online about batteries. I need to start coming back here more often to learn from you guys and share what I know.
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post #45 of 117
5/15/06 at 9:08pm
Be more than welcome! I always "take shelter" on the notebook general section, so you can always find me there. I also recommend batteryuniversity.com , seems to be a consensus.
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post #46 of 117
5/15/06 at 11:48pm
Thanks DDDa.! Why do you have to take 'Shelter' ?
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post #47 of 117
5/16/06 at 3:27pm
this guide is great!
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post #48 of 117
5/16/06 at 3:39pm
Any idea's on how to stop the battery charging while attached in the notebook?
I use my NB as a desktop and prefare to leave the battery in if possible but not at the xpence of having it charged up all the time...
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post #49 of 117
5/16/06 at 7:15pm
just a joke... a very bad one, btw. it's a reference to the religious/political threads in off-topic. i like reading and posting on threads there, but if it's RP, i pass and protect myself on the noob discussions at notebook general.

::ask nbf gods to resist the temptations of posting in RP threads::
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post #50 of 117
5/16/06 at 8:00pm
dumb u r, shut up u must

wots that got to do with batteries!!!?
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post #51 of 117
5/18/06 at 12:15am
Huh?!? I don't get it.

I mean, that's an area for you to put your image and any phrase you want. I just wanted to put as identification an image of Yoda (I'm a big fan) and a joke directed to forum trolls and other stupid people. Since I want the phrase to be related to the image, I wrote it in the same way that Yoda speaks. Isn't that what everyone does?

Look at D6400: he has a Dell as image, and a "cool", "funny" whatever phrase related to the image to enforce the "joke", "coolness" etc.

Another example could be the iSmurf: he has an smurf as image, with phrase "Pull my finger... punk".
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post #52 of 117
5/18/06 at 1:47am
I hear that when u first get ur laptop battery you should charge it to 100%, then completely let it run out. then charge it back to 100% again. This helps it remember its full capacity. Any other things like that that can help keep a battery life going strong?
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post #53 of 117
5/18/06 at 10:43am
batteryuniversity.com

I don't think LiIon batteries should be calibrated... I never did that since 2004 (when I discovered this great board)... with my new notebook, cell phones etc. and never had a problem. actually, after doing the right way, I did notice that my batteries lasted longer. The greatest example is my notebook's battery, which is almost 2 years old and is still good. Lost capacity, of course, but nothing to worry about.
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post #54 of 117
5/24/06 at 10:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirius
I've installed the Turion64 drivers from AMD. But except for the network card, it's not possible to throttle down or turn off any other devices in hardware manager. Only way is to deactivate manually.
Interesting. You should now be able to control things like your CD/DVD drive, and maybe your wired (dial-up) modem as well, if you have one, and the firewire/LAN port, PCMCIA port, etc., using the Power Management tab. But not all devices will get a PM tab. The effectiveness of the new AMD drivers in any case will depend on your motherboard, i.e. the degree of control you get is dependent on whether the motherboard allows certain hardware to be powered down via software. Some things, like the USB ports on some laptops, including mine, are "always on" & there's nothing you can do about it. Other laptops I think you can turn off the USB ports.

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with your computer model, so I wouldn't know whether the new Turion driver is doing its job or not. You could try e-mailing AMD tech support or the tech support for the manufacturer of your computer (Asus?).

It's true, though, that the hardware manager route won't let you throttle/deactivate all of your hardware--some hardware just wasn't meant to be controlled that way. However, I'm surprised you can't control more of your hardware. Maybe you're missing a Cool'n'Quiet driver? Or maybe if you uninstalled, then reinstalled Cool'n'Quiet?

I should mention that several AMD drivers have just been updated for May 2006. The newer driver is no doubt the one you already downloaded, sirius, but I figure I should mention it for other readers.
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post #55 of 117
5/24/06 at 7:16pm
Just my 2c worth...
I recently bought some brand new Li-ion batteries for my 8890's.
They were really *brand-new* as in they had *never* been charged at all.
The problem I had was that they would not charge until I discovered a trick...

The first time I tried to charge them the orange charge light on the laptop just started to flash rather than stay on. This indicated that the battery was not charging properly. The thing is most Li-ion battery packs contain smart chips in them that control the charge function. With a brand new battery this chip had not even been powered up to reset itself.

What I had to do was to leave the battery in the laptop with the flashing charge light going for about 2 hours. Then turn off the AC charger, press the on switch so that the battery tried to start the laptop. Because the battery was not charging properly it only had a miniscule amount of charge in it even after 2 hours, BUT it was enough charge to power up the internal battery smarts, reset them and THEN allow the battery to charge properly.

As recommended you should "condition" new Li-ion batteries by running at least 3-5 full charge/discharge cycles. This gives the battery chemistry a chance to permeate all the twisty little passages (anyone remember the maze in the old text based Adventure game or am I showing my age again?).

As to long term use on AC power, what I do is to use my older less capable batteries when I know I am going to have AC on for any length of time then insert my newer batteries a few hours before I need them on the road - this way they charge to 100% and don't get worn out by constant AC trickle charging.
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post #56 of 117
5/25/06 at 12:59am
Which trickel charge?

I don't know about your laptop but when my battery is charging the charge LED comes on.

When the notebook is left on 24 hours a day, 7 days a week the battery isn't being charged. It's just sitting dormantly in the NB.

Only when the notebook has been disconnected from the mains and re-connected the battery charge function springs into action.

As explained here in the thread, leaving the battery in the NB all the time could make it warm or even hot thus effectively reducing the battery life.

If you have a NB where the battery is sitting away from heat sources like in my Z83 (A7D/J) 17 inch Asus (the battery is up front) leaving it in won't harm it. Asus were always intelligent computer manufacturers.

But unfortunately more recent top of the range Asus NB models are following the other manufacturers by sticking the battery in next to the NB heat sources
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post #57 of 117
5/25/06 at 2:28am
For a battery that has been powered up at least once you will get the charge light staying on continuously until it it fully chaged. In the case of a virgin battery you may get the behaviour I explained.

I hate to burst your bubble on the battery not being charged whilst you are plugged in - it does get used. Without going into too much detail the battery circuit is wired into the power circuit via a reverse polarity diode. When the laptop sucks more juice the battery is the first place the juice comes from. Why? Delays in switch mode power supplies. The battery can provide additional current immediately whereas the switch mode power supplies (which don't have large capacitators in them) have to start chopping more of the AC line into the circuit - this has an inherent delay. It is only small but significant. The battery charge circuit will also notice this and start to top up the battery. This is going on all the time you use the laptop on AC power. Hence my recommendation to keep an old battery in place during extended AC power sessions.

As to disconnecting and reconnecting then the charge circuit kicking in - that is hysteresis in action. The battery charge circuit would be letting the battery drain a little bit before kicking in coloumbs. A power cycle would clear that hysteresis and then force the charge to load it to maximum before applying the hystersis again. Simple control theory.
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post #58 of 117
5/25/06 at 2:42am
Aha...!?!
OK, I've removed my battery!!
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post #59 of 117
5/25/06 at 2:49am
You are lucky you can do that.
The 8890 battery formed part of the chassis with one of the feet stuck on the outside of battery case. So if I take mine out the laptop I have to use italics to counteract the lean
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post #60 of 117
5/26/06 at 2:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by amd-xile
Interesting. You should now be able to control things like your CD/DVD drive, and maybe your wired (dial-up) modem as well, if you have one, and the firewire/LAN port, PCMCIA port, etc., using the Power Management tab. But not all devices will get a PM tab. The effectiveness of the new AMD drivers in any case will depend on your motherboard, i.e. the degree of control you get is dependent on whether the motherboard allows certain hardware to be powered down via software. Some things, like the USB ports on some laptops, including mine, are "always on" & there's nothing you can do about it. Other laptops I think you can turn off the USB ports.

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with your computer model, so I wouldn't know whether the new Turion driver is doing its job or not. You could try e-mailing AMD tech support or the tech support for the manufacturer of your computer (Asus?).



It's true, though, that the hardware manager route won't let you throttle/deactivate all of your hardware--some hardware just wasn't meant to be controlled that way. However, I'm surprised you can't control more of your hardware. Maybe you're missing a Cool'n'Quiet driver? Or maybe if you uninstalled, then reinstalled Cool'n'Quiet?

I should mention that several AMD drivers have just been updated for May 2006. The newer driver is no doubt the one you already downloaded, sirius, but I figure I should mention it for other readers.
I never heard of this either can you post pics of the Tabs and power managment screens you are talking about?
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